Hello,
I am getting my father's 70 Chevelle ready to be put back on the road.
The only problem was that we have lost the title.
I ask the state (Kansas) about it (the car is still in Kansas, while I am in Michigan).
They say I should provide them with the VIN.
So I give them the 136370R...... VIN, and await for their reply by email.
Here is the response:
"
The record I found is for a 1980 Datsun and the person lived in Garden
City. If that is your father he can apply for a duplicate title."

A Datsun?!?!

I tried looking for examples of 1980 Datsun VINs, and what I have found
would not look like my VIN at all.

I am really hoping they made a mistake. They did tell me that they had
to look it up on microfilm.

Any ideas or opinions?

Thanks,
Adrian

They had to have made a mistake. I would try to call them and explain the situation, or resend the duplicate title request. Maybe the digits weren't clear or something.

Is the car registered in your father's name in Topeka?
If so, all he has to do is apply for a duplicate Kansas title.

Dean,
The car has not been registered since the very late 70s~very early 80s. My father made it a dedicated strip car around that time, so it has been unregistered ever since. However, he would have been the last person it would have been registered to.

I just hope the person that I have been working with will continue to do so. I was very careful in my wording as to not offend them by telling them that the idea that the VIN in no way could be from a Datsun. I politely mentioned that I had found a place on the internet that confirmed the VIN was from a Chevrolet Chevelle.

Thanks,
Adrian

just call them back and have them check again, i think that it would be very unlikley that a datsun and a arlington built chevelle V8 2 door coupe had the same vin. #s:D

Maybe the records have been purged and no longer exist.

I received a reply this morning:
"Sorry I didn't find more. In Kansas you can sell a vehicle that is 35 years
or older on a bill of sale. Will Michigan accept that?Or your father could
do a bill of sale from himeself to himself and get a motor vehicle
inspection. This would get the title in his name. Then he could sign it
over to you."

She also gave a phone number to call if I had any questions.

I'm not sure what she means by vehicle inspection.

Any advice?

Thanks,
Adrian

a vehicle inspection means the DMV wants to see the VIN tag. proof of inspection by a police officer may be enough and the police should have proper form to fill out. if you still have problems contact me and I can provide correct paperwork from alabama to get you a new correct title in anyone's name you designate.

IN Kansas vehicles are inspected by the KHP on every vehicle coming in from another state.
The inspection consists of checking the VIN for signs of tampering and verifying that it matches with the title/paperwork.
In addition they check under the hood and verify that the number of cylinders match what is on the paperwork.

Not that I'm any authority but I've never heard of a car being "unregistered" in Kansas once it's registered, it should still be in the computer in the last person's name.

I suppose it's possible that the records have been purged :confused:

Might be a lot simpler to get a new title from huffhuff.

You said the car is still in Kansas, do you have the Kansas title and is it in your dad's name?

Maybe I can help somehow:confused:

Hi Dean,
A quick rundown:
The problem is that my father has lost the title.
It was in his name, and it was a Kansas title.
He purchased the vehicle in Wichita in the mid 70s, so that is when he would have received the title.
The car is in Wichita.
It does not have the original 396 that was in it, but it has a GM crate 454 LS-7 that my father purchased and installed back in the very early 90s. So, the number of cylinders would match what the VIN has indicated.

I'm still very confused about it coming back as a 1980 Datsun. I have done some searching about Datsun VINs, and they do not look anything like what a '70 Chevelle would.

I will probably try to call her and try to convince her that the VIN could in no way be from a Datsun.

As for a new title from huffhuff, I am suprised that it could be done like that. Is there something I should know?

Thanks again,
Adrian

a vehicle inspection means the DMV wants to see the VIN tag. proof of inspection by a police officer may be enough and the police should have proper form to fill out.

This is the way I would go. Does your father have anything that could show proof of ownership? Things like an old insurance slip or even pictures of the car from years ago. This may help with the inspection go more smoothly if you have some history of the car. I don't know the laws in your state but you may end up with a state issued VIN number that may or may not affect the value of your car.

Paul

what i do is register your vehicle in my name in alabama, a non-title state. i then "sell" the car to you with a notarized bill of sale and furnish "my" registration. these will get you a Kansas title. your problem is compounded by the fact that anything registered before computerization and not renewed from year to year will not be in the computer.

I dunno, I think maybe I would still pursue filling out a request for duplicate KS title if your dad is still around.
Naturally, only the person to whom the car is registered can file for a duplicate title.

I'm thinking you need to talk to someone else at KS DMV.
I know if you ask 5 different people there a question you'll get 5 different answers, same as dealing with the IRS.
Like Paul said, any old papers with the VIN on them might help.

OR, talk to huffhuff.

Sorry if I missed it but it appears your exchanging emails and replys back and fourth. Why not get someone in the state of Kansas on the phone and get an actual live person to help you?:confused:

Sorry if I missed it but it appears your exchanging emails and replys back and fourth. Why not get someone in the state of Kansas on the phone and get an actual live person to help you?:confused:


I've wondered this from the start of this thread.


Rocky

Hello everyone,
I called late yesterday and spoke with the person I had been exchanging emails with.
Here is what she said that I needed to do.

Because the vehicle is 35 years or older, it is considered an antique vehicle by the state.
(To be antique, the body, chassis, and engine all must be 35 or older)
With antique vehicles, the process to get a new title is:
1. A bill of sale will be produced in which my father sells the car from himself to himself
2. A vehicle inspection is performed by the state highway patrol

The cost of the inspection is $10, and the cost for a new title is $10.

I asked how the VIN I submitted to her could come up with a totally different vehicle, and she said that there must be overlapping VINs in the system. I asked if a mistake could have been made in looking in the old files, and she said it was possible, but not probable. I made a polite attempt to request that someone look again just in case, and she replied that the same thing would most likely happen again.

On a side note, she asked if it was a SS. I told her it was, and she told me that she had owned a 69 SS Chevelle at one time, and how great of a car it was.

I really do not want a state issued VIN when I have a perfectly good one right there on the plate on the dash, but who knows what will happen.

In reality, the car has more sentimental value to me than monetary value, and I want to get this title thing fixed as soon as possible so that my wife and kids can have fun with it.

Thanks,
Adrian

The saga continues...

I contact the office that does the vehicle inspection, and speak with the officer that would do the inspecting.

After I explain to him the situation, he tells me that he can't do anything for me if I do not have a title, which contradicts what the state told me about obtaining a title.

He advised me to fill out the application for duplicate title, and send to Topeka.

I mailed my father a copy I printed out from their online forms site, and he will send it out next week.

I guess it is then a waiting game to see what happens next.

It is very frustrating to say the least.

I have a 72SS that was built at the Leed's plant and delivered to Branine Chevrolet in Mulvane, KS. I sent to the Kansas Bureau of motor vehicles for the owner history (2002). At the time it cost $10 and I had to fill out a form on there web site. I got all the title/registration info from the day it was delivered to the day it left Kansas. They do have the info but they changed the privacy laws post 2002 and this info is no longer available to the general public. If the car was in your dads name you should be able to get a duplicate title.

The latest:
My father took the application for duplicate title down to the county tag office.
They researched the VIN, and could not find it in the system.
Then, they told him that the VIN should be 17 characters, not the 13 we have on the application.

My head hearts.

Thats because thats how many characters there was back then. 17 characters was added years later. And why should that matter how many characters there is or isnt to them, the number doesnt register and there for you should have been able to use it. Even if there was 100 digits, if it doesnt show up then you should have every right to register your car to use it.

I'd ask him to return to the DMV and speak to a different person. I have found that an older, more experienced person will often know a whole bunch more about older cars. Sort of like going to an auto parts place and asking for engine specific rather than car specific parts.... usually the people have no idea of what you are asking for. It is 'not in the computer'.

I'm not a big fan of the way Kansas does things within the DMV. I bought my 70 Chevelle while I was stationed in Kansas, all was well. That is until I came home to Ohio to register it and my vin didn't match the title because someone at the DMV typed a "S" instead of a 5 . It took removing my HVAC box from the firewall then finally having my vin verified off of the frame. What a PITA not to mention the fact that they are slow as molasses when it comes to mailing out documents.

Dave

The GM service manual, "Chevelle, Malibu, & El Camino ID Numbers 1964-87" and "Chevelle SS Restoration Guide" for example have words and pictures showing and describing the VIN tag, etc. Take digital photos, make a pencil tracing of the VIN and drag all that down there and work your way up the food chain til someone gives in.

When working with the government, I've found that you can get a different answer to the same question almost every time you ask a different person. Keep asking until you get the right answer!

Ask your local county Treasurer for a bill of sale. They should have them at the counter. The ones I have clearly state that any vehichle over 35 years old, only need a bill of sale to transfer ownership, as long as the vehicle is maintained/garaged in Kansas. Year, Make, Vin, Purchase price, Date of sale is what is needed for an inspection. Bill of sale states this notice.

All 1950 or newer antique vehicles sold on a bill of sale must obtain an MVE-1 (Motor Vehicle Examination) issued be the Kansas Highway Patrol or their designee and submit the MVE-1 with this bill of sale when applying for antique title. Apllication for title must be made within 30 days of the purchase date in the county treasurer's motor vehicle office in the county in which the vehicle will be located/garaged. Penalty will be assessed on and after the 31st day.

If you like, I can make a copy of this bill of sale, and send it to you or your dad. The only problem I can for see, is that if the Bill of Sale is put into your name from your dad, the laws of your state may come into affect. Unless you can show residence in Kansas. I have done this several times, and have had no problem. The HWY Patrol should be able to tell you who the last owner was. Since it is your dad, there should be no problem. They do this checks, to find out if the car is stolen and ect.Let me know if I can be of any help.

UPDATE:
Back in May, my father filled out the request for duplicate title, and mailed it to the state DMV.
Around three weeks later, he received a letter from the state saying that the title could not be found.

So, I called the state again, and I was advised to fill out another form to do a title search. Within a week, my father sent out the form, along with the $10 required.

After not hearing anything for about 3 weeks, I called the person I had spoken with who advised us to send in the title search form. I told her that my father's health was getting pretty bad (unfortunately, this is true), and that I needed to know what to do in case he passed away.

She was very helpful, and said that she would push the request to the head of the line.

A few days later, my father received a copy of the title in the mail.

Now, I need to call her back and ask what steps I need to do to get an actual duplicate title. I assume that her reply will be to send in the duplicate title request form, along with another $10 and the copy of the title that we received (I have already made duplicate copies).

It looks like I finally have made some progress, but this has been completely ridiculous.

I will update again with any new developments.

That's the government for ya, good job hanging in and getting something done.

I must be a typo, the 1970 chevelles have a 13 digit vin and the 1980 datsuns have an 11 digit vin. And the datsuns start out HSxxxxxxxxx and 13637xxxxxxxx is definately a chevelle

People (and gov't agencies) rely on computers for everything. When they develop a lot of the software that runs this information they only consider current things such as the 17 digit VIN's and the rest forgotten about or deemed not worth storing due to age, cost of and probability of existence of most old cars. This is the root of all the problems, this is what you are dealing with, unless some is willing to look and knows that paper records exist somewhere, they will tell you they can't find anything.

Not long ago I had problems matching paint colors on my 1992 PU, the NAPA paint shop mixed the wrong color 2x in a row. I refused to pay for the wrong shade of blue and got into a heated argument with 25 yo mix tech. The manager came over and sided with him until an older counter guy stepped in. He said, did you check the book to see what the code matched? NO, they did not nor did they think they had any books to check until he dug under the counter and found 1992 book and what do you know, the computer had the wrong mix codes for my paint color. So what do you thing happened next, the paint mix tech argued the book was wrong and so was I, he mixed it right and I owe them over $100 for the paint. The manager then instructed him to mix what the book said was correct and it turned out the be a perfect match to the blue paint. Some people don't know what to do if they can't find the answer in a computer.

I appreciate everyone's comments.

I spoke with the woman who I had been working with this morning.
She said that I need to send the copies of the documents I just received, along with the letter from the state saying that they could not find the title in their records back to the state, and my father should be getting an actual duplicate title in a week or so.

Hopefully I will have good news to share by then.

UPDATE:
My father received the duplicate title finally last week. He signed it over to me, and I just received it yesterday.
I will be taking it to the secretary of state here in Michigan today to be put in my name.

I can't believe it is finally over.

Timing is just about right, as I will be receiving the vehicle from transport on Sunday or Monday, and I can't wait to get it on the road.

:hurray: :thumbsup: