I was wondering what would it take for a big block to get a 70 chevelle in the mid 10 sec.
is there anyone out there doing this??? if so what motor size are ya running. I was into G body
Malibu's befor this new project and guys on that site where saying that a good 468 bb could do this .what do you think ?there is even a tech page there on that site that kinda tells you how using 781 ported heads with some good parts BUDGET SPEED. can a heavy chevlle do the same or DO YA GOTTA GO BROKE
TRYING

You can do it with a 468 or even a 350 dont plan on running on pump gas. Maybe a 468 could do it. Gte your ported 781's 12-13 cr and a nice 250@.050 cam with .680 lift solid roller a dominator and a nice single plane brodix youll be set with around 700hp prolly just a rough idea

This will do it !!!


***Updated***


BSE Big Block

454+ .060"= 467ci
-Wiesco closed chamber style pistons with Speed Pro Plasma Moly file fit rings
-11:1 CR
-Clevite bearings - mains, rod and cam
-Fel-Pro gaskets
-Crower Sportsman rods and Crower 4340 crank with ARP main studs and GM windage tray
-Moroso 6-Quart kicked-out pan # 20401 with pickup # 24440
-Melling oil pump high pressure
-RollMaster Billet double roller timing chain
-#215 closed chamber oval port heads '67 - '68 with 2.25 / 1.88 Undercut valves,
valves Unshrouded, gasket matched and bowls blended (valve job angles 30/45/70)
*note* head work done by Richard Biebel Racing
-Performer RPM Air gap Rectangular port manifold.
-Pro-Systems Pro Series 4150 "1000HP" downleg boosters
-1/2" 4 hole spacer over a 1/2" open spacer.
-GM carb heat shield
-LSM billet roller cam: 254/260 dur. .660"/.660" lift 107LSA 7/4 2/3 firing order
swap comp #933 springs (Coated). Crower severe duty lifters
-Rocker Arms- Crane Gold Race 1.7 rockers
-3/8" one piece pushrods
-MSD ignition- 6AL box, blaster II coil and Pro Billet distributor
-Headers - Dynomax 1 3/4" PRIMARY TUBE with 3" collectors. Remove collector weld on
Flowmaster Scavenger Collectors # C-134214300
-3-1/2" head pipes with 3-1/2" X-crossover and 3" dumps after mufflers. All bends to
be mandrel. DynoMax Oval UltraFlo mufflers
-Mallory Comp 140 fuel pump, regulator and filter plumbed to stock 3/8" fuel line.
-Mobil 1 0W-20 oil, Ford type F trans fluid and Mobil 1 gear lube
-indexed spark plugs
With a turbo 400 prepped by STR, ATI 8" Treemaster converter, CSI Super Shield,
Stock Horse Shoe Shifter 4.10 gears and either slicks or DOT slicks this combo will
run 10.40's depending on weather, tuning and driver Best: 10.37 @ 127.2 mph with a
1.35 60ft off the footbrake, through the exhaust at 3860 lbs.
-Delco 94 amp alternator with internal regulator #10495426 and a Delco battery
Group24 #78DT/84
-Denny's HD aluminum driveshaft 1350 U-joints and yokes
-ATI balancer
--15" x 10" Weld Pro Star wheel 5-1/2" backspacing. 30" x10" w/12.5" section width,
CO7 Hoosier Radial slick.
-Koni Street adjustable shocks set full stiff rear/full soft front
-Alf Weibe stock eliminator rear suspension w/Control arm braces that triangulate
the control arm mounts
-Front springs are Moog 5392 combined with Koni Gas shocks set at full soft and poly
graphite bushings set without any preload. The front sway bar has been removed
-front springs Moog 5392
17.95".......................Free height
11.50".......................loaded
266 lbs./in..................rate
.61...........................wire diameter
2026.........................total load

Front/rear weight bias = 59/41

Many ways to get there, My motor hardly works to run 10's. Capable of low 10's with a few component changes. It is currently setup to run on the street very easily with 3.42's 89 octane, run 10.70's in good air, 10.90's in nasty air.

Budget way to get there includes some forged slugs, a dedicated nitrous cam, and a snoot full of laughing gas. You said cheap, remember.

To be CAPABLE of running mid tens assuming about 3800lbs you need an engine that makes enough power to run about 126-128 or so.
This is about 625-650 honest hp.
Ok, now you have the power,,, the rest is up to you :D
All you need to do is make the car work & you will be there tongue.gif
The engine is the easy part.

Originally posted by Wolfplace:

The engine is the easy part. ....So Very True !!!!

Sounds easy Tom.

So basically, all I would have to do is cut a half second from my 60' time (should be easy enough considering I could walk faster than this car) and add 20 mph to the top end!

I am not so depressed now.

Or you could do it with a "Mouse" :cool:

Ed does it but no one else has been able to come close with his combo. He spends many hours on tuning and chassis setup. For most people it will take a much stouter engine (last I heard Ed was running a roller and turning the motor to 6700 rpm) which has kind of gotten away from the original idea. The 540 is an excellent idea mainly because you won't have to push the engine nearly as hard and it should live much longer. Get the chassis right and be prepared to keep a real good eye on drivetrain parts. Years ago I got a 4000# 4spd car into the 10s but I got sick of breaking drivetrain parts and built a 2800# car with a much milder motor and an auto trans.

I don't know if anyone here has duplicated it to a T...I know gatewayracer,kjett are running their versions at 468 cubic inches and closing in on those numbers,Todd is running those numbers with over 50 fewer cubic inches. Hell, I'll be happy if I just get a 10.99 timeslip with my version, Ed's old roller,Comp cam 654/661 286/292 248/254 107 ICL and 107 LSA with prepped 781 oval ports.

i think my combo was pretty cheap .......like it was said the engine was the easy part......now i need to get my chassis set up.....i spent just under 3500 bucks for everything on my motor..including carb, intake, pulleys, brackets, belts, oil, everything.........it nickeled and dimed me to death tho for all the small stuff

just to give an idea on some of the prices i paid and parts i used to get my barely ten second ride with a crapped out chassis set up....

750 bucks got me a deal from the local machinist-454 block of my choice from his cores....block was bored .060,deck just to true,tanked,new cam bearing installed,freeze plugs installed,mains line bored,2 bolt bottom end,his used rotating assy. from his old 468 that was used for mud runs that turned 8200 rpms....he freshened up the crank with a 10/10 turn down,left the stock rods alone that had been lightened and sides polished with arp bolts, left the trw 12.9 to 1 compression domed pistons on them,he just checked the big end to make sure they was still good. gave me the matching balancer and flex plate.

275 bucks i bought a used solid roller cam (made buy doug herbert) 254/268 @ .050" .685 lift with the matching roller lifters and push rods.

600 bucks i paid the machinist to fit and finish my heads (oval port) after i did a "back yard port and polish job" he bought and installed the triple springs ,ss valves, 3 angle valve job, new guide liners, machine the spring pads and guides for clearences, guides, studs,retainers, keepers,teflon seals, tanking was included.

350 bucks for the 850 carb with adjustable jets that go thru the bowls, choke horn cut off,thinned shafts and butterflys, deburred and cleaned.

220 bucks for the victor jr intake.

130 bucks for the piston rings 1/16"

170 bucks for the gear drive

175 bucks for the roller rockers

80 bucks cheap summit headers

all the other stuff i bought, studs for the mains,windage tray, crank scrapper,new oil pan,melling oil pump and pick up with steel sleeved shaft,oil pump baffle,gasket kit,oil ,filter,water pump, alternator, belt, used pulleys from junk yard and brackets,timming chain cover,valve covers and breather, K&N filter assy.,linkage for carb,plugs, wires, used hei dist., and what ever else i might of left out..

my outings was in my 81 camaro with a race weight of 3600 lbs.....was kicked off track to say slightly because of no roll bar or safety equipment........traction was not good at all.....with just sub frame connectors and homemade slapper bars.......car is under reconstruction for the chassis and to meet saftey guide lines since i ran it with no c-clip eliminators ,no roll bar, no tranny shield and so on......

i was not expecting to run into the tens but i got a few 10.80 passes in as well as a few low 11's at just over 126 mph.....before the track tech got me and said no more......scary ride thats for sure.....hopefully with a tuned chassis and get a chance to dial in the motor i should see some mid 10's easy.......i'm hopeing the 150 hp nitrous plate will send me into the nines..........

Originally posted by Mike Feudo:
Ed does it but no one else has been able to come close with his combo. He spends many hours on tuning and chassis setup. For most people it will take a much stouter engine (last I heard Ed was running a roller and turning the motor to 6700 rpm) which has kind of gotten away from the original idea. The 540 is an excellent idea mainly because you won't have to push the engine nearly as hard and it should live much longer. Get the chassis right and be prepared to keep a real good eye on drivetrain parts. Years ago I got a 4000# 4spd car into the 10s but I got sick of breaking drivetrain parts and built a 2800# car with a much milder motor and an auto trans. No one has build Ed's hydraulic combo to spec!

What many do not realise, is that every part was selected for a reason, and every part is helping the combo ET.

The combo as it stands now, is still very much a prime example of the "BSE" principal in design. The idea is to emphasize power in the RPM range that the combo uses. To move a heavy car, you need to make it leave hard, and emphasize a powerful torque curve!

Robert G, there are a number of folks running mid to low 10's here, you can run searches and find them all. No secret receipe, or 'only one way'. You'll find a number of well engineered combination that run 10.40 or better. Some of thesee are not street/strip as you might imagine. Mike in CA, Pat in FL, Ken in GA, 68 Hot Rod, etc, etc, etc...most using 454 blocks... all post here and would gladly share their combos. Stiff compression, good port work/valves, and a solid roller would be mandatory I should think.

Most of those fellas run rect ports, but the ovals shouldn't hold you back! ;)

My car is very streetable and I have run a best of 10.77 @ 128. I'm working on the suspension now to try and get the ET in line with the mph. I have a 454+.030 with 241 ovals with 2.19/1.88 valves and a hydraulic Comp cam. I do have a Procharger P600b making around 6 psi of boost. The car is fairly mild mannered until you open up the secondaries and the boost comes in.

I see Ed is lurking. Just got one of his E-mails informing me I was wrong about anyone using his exact combo. There are people that are awfully close but I will stand corrected if it's that big a deal. All I was trying to do was pay the man a compliment for his time and effort to make a combo work to its max.

The 4.375 x 4 more commonly known as a 482 works good.This requires a good, thick block though. Most will go +.100 to 475 inches without trouble. My son's car went 10.48 with a flat tappet cam and square port, open chamber, heads. Adding "335 CNC" Dart heads dropped it into the low 10s at 130+ MPH. The best was a 9.98 @ 133.7 MPH. This motor has a lot of compression though and isn't pump gas friendly. Adding a 4.25" crank makes all this even more powerful. ZL-1 copy camshaft.

i ran one of those ZL-1 cams for about 4 years or so on the street in a 396 motor i was able to get mid 11's at 115 mph with that simple stick and 11.7 to 1 compression.....cranking compression was 150 psi i ran it on 91 octane and it loved to rpm......it would take 7500 and keep pulling to there.....but i put a 7200 rpm limit on the combo so it would live alittle longer...gave up a few mph in the 1/4 but it sure was a wild ride for a street car.....150 hp shot of nitrous pushed it into the tens a few times..........

Dennis, that's hairy! Last time we ran the old L88 cam was in a bud's 67 Camaro, M21, 4.56s. It would just start revving up adn then would break the tires loose at around 6000...wild...of course, in 1976 we didnt have good street rubber

He, He!!

"Break the tires loose at 6000!!"... Love it.....

He, He!!

I want my 496 grunt motor to break them loose in third at around 5000rpm.. Don't know if 535 or so hp will do it at that rpm level?? (M-20, 3.31's and say 26" tall tires)..

And I will be happy! If not tell me what it will take???

pdq67

69bowty, Blower cars always seem to MPH better than they E.T.. Yours does appear to have a couple of tenths left in traction though.