Hey guys, I have one more 454 (2 bolt) lying around and since I planned on using it sometime in the future, I dropped it off at the machine shop to get tanked, mag'd, then machined. Well today the machinist calls to tell me he found out a crack on the passenger side, between the first freeze plug boss and it runs almost to the fuel pump boss.

Needless to say, no machining was done. The crank can't be seen with the naked eye, but its there. I had planned on having it drilled for 4 bolt caps, then studded/align bored, cylinders bored/honed, decked, and cam bearings/freeze plugs installed.

Here's the question. Can this block be welded up and reused?

I have had a few suggestions from friends on how to deal with it.

#1: Have a decent shop weld the block using some very expensive MIG wire called 'nickel 99' (or something like that).

#2: Have a decent shop heat the block to 400+* and weld on it with 'iron rod', then cool very slowly.

#3: Lastly, bevel the crack, clean very, very well, and fill/press-in the crack/groove with some type of metal expoxy like JB Weld, etc (sounds like it wouldn't last)


I'd rather not have to toss the block since in the trash since I remember paying a decent amount of coin for it, plus its a good, thick walled casting.


Thanks guys!!

http://www.muggyweld.com/index2.html

Try this out - I am going to make a similar repair and am going to give their cast iron welding rods a try.

I got a free bowtie block fresh and ready to go - but it once had an external water leak. It was repaired with a patch/epoxy and did not leak, but I am going to pressure test it and if it leaks, I will try muggyweld.

Originally posted by 66 283:
http://www.muggyweld.com/index2.html

Try this out - I am going to make a similar repair and am going to give their cast iron welding rods a try.

I got a free bowtie block fresh and ready to go - but it once had an external water leak. It was repaired with a patch/epoxy and did not leak, but I am going to pressure test it and if it leaks, I will try muggyweld. It looks like a great product, if it works.

Welding cast iron in general:
http://www.muggyweld.com/castiron.html

Welding a cast iron block:
http://www.muggyweld.com/cast.html
&
http://www.muggyweld.com/blocks.html

When they are talking about 'arc electrodes' are they talking about 'stick welding'?

I just talked to another buddy of mine. He thinks because its just a hairline crack, and its not a high stress critical spot, that some type of "fill" would do the job, but I like the muggyweld idea alot better.

yes, arc = stick welding. What's holding your "fill" in there? Not much - if you do a fill repair you need to make a plate and drill/tap/screw it to the block.

I have a scrap block for mock ups that was badly hurt - I'm going to get some muggy weld electrodes and play with it and do a little destructive testing too.

Cable,
Thanks for the email & the links above.
I hadn't heard of this stuff before but will now have to look into it.
I do not even attempt to weld cast iron any more except for a non contained area as I don't have the ability to heat it to 1200+ degrees but this looks interesting graemlins/thumbsup.gif
I know of people who say you can braze it at about 300 degrees but I haven't had very good luck,, probably because I can't cool it slowly enough,,
Have to call them & see if they have some Tig rod too or better yet Mig wire,,,
I have always used the Lock n Stitch pins for repair before.

I would stitch plug it using the small bolts that are made just for doing this. Get out the old trusty hand-drill, tap holder for the needed plug's tap, two or three needed drill bits, a sharp center punch and small Ford Tool.

Set the block up on a motor stand and I bet you can get it done in a couple of hours..

All the plugs do are overlap the threads to seal the crack as you just drill one hole after the first plug is in place. Then repeat until you get to the end of the crack...

They use this method on GREAT BIG stationary diesel powerplant multi-cylinder engines when the extremely high operating forces crack the main web area and other areas as a standard repair procedure.

I think you can buy kits??????

pdq67

Originally posted by pdq67:
I would stitch plug it using the small bolts that are made just for doing this. Get out the old trusty hand-drill, tap holder for the needed plug's tap, two or three needed drill bits, a sharp center punch and small Ford Tool.

Set the block up on a motor stand and I bet you can get it done in a couple of hours..

All the plugs do are overlap the threads to seal the crack as you just drill one hole after the first plug is in place. Then repeat until you get to the end of the crack...

They use this method on GREAT BIG stationary diesel powerplant multi-cylinder engines when the extremely high operating forces crack the main web area and other areas as a standard repair procedure.

I think you can buy kits??????

pdq67 =
Here's the good stuff ;)
http://locknstitch.com/

http://www.locknstitch.com/ Takes some practice, but works great.

There's a company in West Chester, Pa. that does specialty pump repairs. They have a procedure to cold weld engine blocks. You can probably call one of many pump repair companies in Cali also.

Originally posted by BillK:
http://www.locknstitch.com/ Takes some practice, but works great. I've heard about the lock 'n stitch site before, but there are no pictures of a finished product on their site, kinda lame if you ask me.

But I don't think it would help me anyway since the crack goes into the machined area of the freeze plug boss.

I spent most of my working life dealing with one company or another claiming to have magic weld rod that will weld anything. Personal experience has been it's all BS. The only way to correctly weld or braze cast iron is too heat it to 1200deg and work from there. You may get lucky and stick enough weld on a small area to sort of seal off a pin hole or such but anything of any size must be done correctly. The stiching method with plugs works very well if you can get to the area. Personally since you have done no machine work I would find another block.

Ditto Mike about the BS, imho too..

And yes, you can use stitch pins in machined areas!!

Just grind them down smooth and go right on.

Like I said they use this repair method on BIG engines in the main bearing webbing areas.

pdq67

IMO I would ditch the block since it is not something original to the car. It is not worth spending the money to weld. Look for another one.

Add this to it. I think the stitching runs close to about $100.00/ inch installed.

Digging up one of my old posts guys......

I still have the block and I am seriously considering using it to build a nice 600+ HP 496.

I've mentioned the block to the local machinist I've been using here and he also recommends using the lock 'n stitch. I forgot to ask pricing though.....oops.

I looked through the catalog and it looks like the C-type locks is the one I'd wanna use.

In the interest of saving money, is this the kind of repair I can do myself?

Thanks guys.

if i had a numbers matching block for a high dollar ride i might consider using the lock and stitch method, maybe. that is only if i found a source that was very accomplished/experienced at doing it (i.e. mike or bill for instance). other than that i would probably just find a better block to build. welding can be done with limited success i suppose but i am personally not very confident in a weld repair in cast iron when the component is then subjected to the vibration and thermal cycling that an engine is. i had a cast iron piece welded one time on a heavy duty lawn tractor but it was only subjected to stresses from a hydraulic cylinder with no thermal component to the stress. in that case it was tig welded with a high dollar nickle filler wire by a high dollar certified welder. it lasted for years but that is not the same thing as an engine for the reasons i noted above. my personal opinion is that that weld would eventually crack right along the heat affected zone or maybe even right thru the middle of the weld. mike commented above about things such as preheat and restricted cooling...those are absolutley critical in repairing cast iron (and many other materials for that matter). a braze would have some potential but only if it could be done in a vacuum furnace with controlled cool and quench which would cost much more than the block is even remotely worth. just my opinion based on a career of many years of trying to fix things that got broke. good luck whichever way you go.