I've been pricing out what it's going to cost me to mix Toluene and 93 Octane for my 10.8:1 496. So far, I'm not happy with the numbers I'm seeing in the price vs. performace standpoint with the Toluene.

I've been doing a little reading about this Kemco Lead Supreme 130. Honestly, it sounds too good to be true. If their claims are factual, I can spend between $8 and $10 for a bottle of their product and add it to 93 octane in my 20 gallon tank to make 101 octane (actually only using 30oz of the 32oz bottle). When I compare that to spending approx $6 a gallon on Toluene times 6 gallons ($36) and still only making 99.3 octane, Lead Supreme sounds like the way to go.

Now I'm sure it's not going to take 101 octane to get my 496 right. I'm actually guessing it's really closer to 95-96 but the price difference is outstanding... not to mention it's easier to add 16-32oz to a tank rather than mix high-test and 6 gallons of toluene.

So tell me, who has personally used the Lead Supreme and does it follow through with their claims? Are their any bad side effects to using it (other than the obvious health issues surounding lead). Is it safe for extended use in my engine?

Thanks,
---Chris

Chris,

I haven't used their product but have done some research on octane boost methods. First their claim of 2 - 16 points needs to be put in perspective. From the research I've done this actually means it would take 93 octane to 93.2 to 94.6 depending upon the amount added. Each "point" is actually .1 of octane change. That's why you see very little results with most octane boosters. I was running a 327 with an 8.35 DCR with cast iron heads and no real chamber work on 93.5 (boosting 91 with toluene). What's the DCR number you're trying to run and what type of heads?

Thanks for getting back to me so fast rpol78. The Kemco website is very clear that they say their product doesn't add "points" as decimals, it adds full numerical points. Here's the link: http://www.kemcooil.com/product_info.php?pId=61

An example from the site shows:

0.6- Ounces LS-130 to 1 gallon / fuel……2.0 point octane increase


1.2- Ounces LS-130 to 1 gallon / fuel……3.5 point octane increase


1.8- Ounces LS-130 to 1 gallon / fuel……5.0 point octane increase


2.4- Ounces LS-130 to 1 gallon / fuel……6.5 point octane increase


3.0- Ounces LS-130 to 1 gallon / fuel……8.0 point octane increase


6.0- Ounces LS-130 to 1 gallon / fuel……11.0 point octane increase


18-* Ounces LS-130 to 1 gallon / fuel……16.0 point octane increase


*


EXAMPLE: 18 ounces added to 10 gallons of*fuel will turn a 93 octane*into 98 octane. 30 ounces into a 101 octane. Guaranteed! We have the lab reports to prove it. Due to EPA regulations this product is*for off road use*only.

The above was taken directly from their website, word for word.

To answer your question though, my DCR is 8.02 and the heads are ported 215 castings (101cc).

Thanx again...
---Chris

Check this site out.http://www.team.net/sol/tech/octane_b.html

Chris, Interesting site I hadn't seen the product before. I wonder if there's any separation problems with it. Thinking out loud.

Back to your engine, if your DCR is 8.02 why do you think you'll need 95 to 96 octane? Do you have 92 or 93 pump gas available where you live? I run a 7.9 DCR with iron heads on 91 octane without problems.

I've heard of that additive through the Corvette
circles. I 've not tried it myself but all the fellows who have tried it on their high compression BB say that it works. None of my sources raved about it much but I opine that most sales pitches are based on ideal conditions so I would deduct 10% or more off their declared values, in other words use a little more of their lead additive. BTW, there are regulations restricting transporting lead.

rpol78,
Yes, we have 93 at most gas stations around here. As for thinking it needs 95or 96, I'm not positive that it even does. The engine has been doing some funky things and I'm just trying to narrow down the culprit a little bit. Since I know that 8.02 DCR isn't that wild I'm just guessing that if it is the problem, it shouldn't take much more than 93 to get it to stop.

By now I'm sure you're saying to yourself "what the heck is the problem?" Well, when you first start the engine (while it's cold) it fires right up, runs great and you can shut it right back off and everything seems normal. But, if you start it up and let it get up to operating temperature and then try to shut if off, there's a slight bit of run on (dieseling). I know everyone is saying I just need to do some tuning and that will stop. But wait, there's more! If I try to restart the engine while it's hot, it backfires so hard that it stops the starter from turning it over (actually it sounds like a louder-than-normal backfire but it's strong enough to force the rotating assembly back in the opposite direction--- this is what makes me think detonation... it's happening way before TDC).

I can't hear any detonation going down the road but honestly it's a pretty loud car and I can't hear the engine over the exhaust. I figure it's worth it to rule this out before trying to find a mechanical problem that might not be there.

Like I said, when it's cold and even when it's warmed up and running, it's great. Awesome power, doesn't sound or act funny, seems like a great engine. It's just after all that that things start to go to pot.

---Chris

It sounds like the carb is leaking fuel into the intake. What type of carb are you running, what condition is it in, and have you checked float levels?

One more thing, what's your timing set at?

Maybe you have some crud stuck in your carb, I had a similar problem and that was the culprit( I think)

I pinched off the fuel line while the engine was running and then released it later on when it sounded like it was gonna die....no probs since
Worked for me

The carb is a Holley 950 HP built by All State Carbs, brand new (well it and the engine both have about 250 miles on them now). I checked the float level when I first fired off the engine and it was spot-on. Just a little fuel would spill out over the bottom threads when you give the fender a nudge. I went ahead and checked it again this morning and it was still perfect.

Timing is set at about 12* BTDC. I say "about" because I have an adjustable timing pointer that came loose so I'm not 100% positive it's set at exactly TCD anymore. I just eyeballed it back where it was before. Anyone know a more accurate way to get it exact?

Thanks for the replies guys,
---Chris

I use the Kemco additive with great results in my 10.7 to 1, 620 hp 454, and run nitrous on top of that. Mr car does not like the crap 91 octane we are stuck with here in California, but with the Kemco no more piston specs on the spark plugs and it cut way back on the motor run on when I shut it off. I mix mine to 94 octane.

I'm just surprised there's not more people using this stuff and posting about it. It's like hush...hush...One of our local cruising newspapers has an ad for it.

Where can you get it for less than list price?

I figure if I drop down to 89 octane and pick up 2 points (making 91) for .10/gal. cheaper, I can knock (excuse the pun) the cost down to a net of $1.75 per 20 gallons. I can do that. That makes it $0.0875/gal. more expensive than premium and I get lead for my valves.

So is it agreed? This stuff isn't just snake oil? I think what I may do is just order a couple 32oz bottles and try it out. Shouldn't hurt the pocket book to bad that way.

---Chris

DaleP,
The only place I've found it other than through the manufacturer is BatteryStuff.com. http://www.batterystuff.com/fuel/fuel_treatments.htm#LS-130 Looks like you can buy the $120 set for $110 from them. $10 cheaper isn't a lot but it's beter than nothing. :cool:

---Chris

I think a gallon of good old Ethyl used to have at a max. 4 grams of TEL in it per gallon so go from there!!

AND it has been proven that as low as something like .1 gram/gal. fights valve recession real good if I have my decimal point right??

That 59.4 grams of TEL per galloon in it will cut down a long ways..

pdq67

Sounds like you need to advance your timing about 5-6 degrees. If the timing is too retarded for the cam it will do the things you are describing. Try like 18° btdc and see if it detonates at full throttle under load.

Thanx for the replies guys. Bob, I'll try putting a little more timing in it and let yall know how it turns out. Gotta go put some more fuel in it tomorrow before I start playing with it again. She's a pretty thirsty girl...

---Chris