Hey,

My friend and I had a lil argument about which is more american: blower or nos...

Since neither of us are american, any feedback is greatly appreciated...

It smells like civil war, I know, I know...

vortech08,

Estonia, Europe

There was a post a few weeks ago about which to use: nitrous or a blower; which got an extensive amount of replies to. As to which is more American, thats a tough question. I have posted before that I am definatly pro blower so I'll wave my flag and say that supercharging is more American. Supercharging goes back to the early 50's on automobiles in the U.S. S.C.O.T. made a supercharger for the flathead ford way back when. I know nitrous was used on WWII fighter planes but I think the blower precedes it in automotive use. Just my .02!! Bob

They're both American in equal amounts.

I see it as the uniquely American desire to make things bigger, better, faster, etc. We are a county of excessiveness, and both Nitrous and Blowers are prime examples of our constant desire to exceed the limits of what we (really) need.

Kurt

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The 68 Chevelle info page. [last updated Nov. 30, 98]
www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Garage/6873/Chevelle/68_Chevelle_Info.html (http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Garage/6873/Chevelle/68_Chevelle_Info.html)
Email: Kbyfield@terracom.net
A.C.E.S. #1352

I'm not american either, but i'll tell you what I think is the most impressive, and that's using neither. You hear about these guys that have a car that can run and e.t. of 14.5 sec. And then they brag about the 11.5 - 12 sec. e.t. that they can run on NOS. Big deal buddy, bottom line is that my car will whip yours on the street. I will never use either on any of my cars because I will deny anyone bragging rights who beats me with nitrous. Now a blower, they aren't really the same because you have the power all the time, I still don't find a blower near as impressive as nothing at all but I would like a nice supercharger over NOS any day. but NO hood scoop or whole in the hood. Oh ya, I was at the track the other day and saw all these cars with stupid looking hood scoops on them, and they only run 13's and 14's! What's up with that. There, now that i've thrown my .02 of gas on the fire we'll see what happens http://www.chevelles.com/forum/smile.gif.

chris

Gandalf,

Yea, you have a point...

No bragging, wannabe scoops etc.
For the record, i am pro blower and carbs, no NOS and EFI and turbos! Not going to screw up an SS either..

So, go ride your honest Shadowfax and leave NOS and other mind magic to Saruman! http://www.chevelles.com/forum/wink.gif

What you got under that hood anyway?

Right now, nothing at all http://www.chevelles.com/forum/wink.gif. I sold my 350 about 3 months ago for $2000, some of you may have seen it in the classifieds on this site. I am currently about 2-3 weeks away from finishing my 454 that's getting dropped in. forged crank, polished connecting rods, bored .40 over, hypereutectic pistons, 290 cast heads, ported and polished by myself, 10.25:1 compression, dynomax headers, performer RPM intake, comp cams 280H camshaft, hyd. lifters, full roller rockers, 3/8 pushrods and guides, currently a holley 700cfm dbl pmp but that's gotta go next winter, planned redline of 6500, 2000 stall, maybe 2500. 3.73 posi rear, th-350 tranny. And NO juice or blower. Desktop dyno rated it at 518 horses which is plenty for me, estimated e.t. of 13.4 which is alright too, seeing as it is a daily driver. And from my trips to the track, daily drivers that get 12's are few and far between. That's my story and i'm stickin to it! http://www.chevelles.com/forum/smile.gif. I'll have an engine start up story for you guys in a couple weeks I hope, god knows i've been talking about this thing for2 years already.

Chris

For what it's worth,I believe neither are originally american. The supercharger was first widely used in the 1930's and 40's on aircraft, primarily british aircraft. Nitrous was used briefly by the germans during this same time, also on aircraft.

Clark

For me, I guess it depends. For the sleeper look, nitrous is better, because it's easier to hide, but then again, a blower is very intimidating. I guess I'd go for the blower, but I'd get a ticket for obstructed vision, so maybe nitrous is the way to go.

Then again, beating a guy with either a blower or nitrous is always cool, if you have neither.

Gee, my head hurts now, better go have another beer.

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70 & 1/2 RS Camaro
SB406 & M20 4spd
9" Rear
70 Malibu
SB350 & TH400

Gold Member # 103

My view is that although blowers make a ton of power and are big on the intimidation scale, I don't care for em.

I've never been a person that likes the flashy cars with a ton of chrome and guages and a blower with twin dominators poking through the hood.

I've always thought that NOS was the best bang for the buck and the easiest to hide. NOS get's my vote.

But when we talk $$ nos is the cheapest hp is it not?

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Ray{Surrey BC}
65SS chevelle
65 2dr chevelle
65 el camino
team #214 gold

N2O has my vote and it should be the vote of every 'budget minded' hot rodder on this site! You cannot beat it as offering the MOST bang for your buck on the street. Just make sure your engine can handle the increased cylinder pressures and you are good to go. I would suggest doing a topic search under 'nitrous' and you will find some other posts about applications and limitations.

And, who cares whether or not you get beat by a nitroused motor or a blown motor? It doesn't really matter what makes the power - the two cars are racing against each other and not the motors. Gee, if you get spanked by a car on the gas, then deal with it by either building a better powerplant or go buy a faster car.

This is my opinion only, but I view nitrous as an optional component of any engine set-up. If your cam is too small and not producing enough low to mid-range torque, what do ya' do? That's right, swap out the cam for a bigger lump stick. Using N2O is the exact same. If I think I don't stand a chance of beating a mid 11 second car, then I'm going to spray it during the race AND I will even let that person know before we race.

I don't use it as some sort of 'hocus pocus' sneaky-stealthy stuff - that mindset was really popular during my younger street racing days. I do not street race. My small-block 'mouse' stroker motor makes only 425hp on the motor and 575 on the gas and over 600ft lbs of torque to boot - if I were to race you at the track, I will tell you that I plan to spray the car during the race - what is wrong with that anyway?

Gee, this otta' open a can or two... http://www.chevelles.com/forum/wink.gif

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70' Malibu - 383 'Dental Gas' Inhaling Stroker! Gold Member #39
Chevellz Alwayz!

Gandalf....be careful what you ask for , you just may get it. My bench seat, all metal, non slicked, stock suspension, full interior 468 ci, Chevelle went 11.50's all day long. Pump gas, no blower, no N20. The new 486 ci should go 10.50's, all day long. No N20, no blower. Looking for high 9's on the juice. Already planning my next motor... around a 700ci pump gasser, no N20, no huffer, with about 800hp. Yeah, I'm gonna spray it to about 1200 hp just "in case". Anyway, who cares how people make power. I think people look stupid who whine about being beat by a blower car or by N20. Don't race, and then make excuses why you get beat. I respect any one who has a fast car, no matter how they get there [unless the car is gutted]. I have no respect, for people who have slow cars and make excuses why their car is slow.
For the record, I don't prefer N20 over blowers. I have N20 because in my area more people use it and have knowledge about it. If it were the other way around, I'd have a blower. My good friend just moved and he has a blower car that should run low 8's when it is done. If he were still here, to teach me I'd probably go the blower route. My point is.. I don't try to be a "Lone Ranger". I want to spend more time in the saddle than out. The wealth of knowledge and experience in your area should be a consideration in chossing which route to take.

I agree with Michael. Bottom line: power is power. Doesn't matter how you make it. People that have an attitude about those that use NOS have never tried it. Regardless of who wins the race, it's awesome stuff! Instant adrenaline!

And if you are comparing it with superchargers, supercharger with NOS are even better. http://www.chevelles.com/forum/wink.gif Works like an intercooler making even more power. They both have their pros and cons. Nitrous is cheap up front, but you pay when you fill the bottles, and they only last for seconds. Blowers work great, but they require rebuilds often if you drive them on the street, they cost a fortune, and they have lots of wear and tear. NOS has no moving parts...

My 496 will have at least a BigShot plate under the Dominator. Maybe a fogger... http://www.chevelles.com/forum/wink.gif


Ryan

I think it's easy, ANYTHING THAT MAKES YOU USE MORE GAS IS "AMERICAN"!

As far as "looks", I can't see a big GMC blower sticking out the hood of a Honda, so I guess that the blower would get my vote.

Talking historically, my first thought is that both would qualify. I believe that it was the P51 mustangs that they put nitrous on, but then, it was a british engine (Rolls Royce). I know that they also used blowers on some Bentleys. So, maybe it would be best to think of both as British. Dang, I hate to think it's true!

Wes.

Gandalf....be careful what you ask for , you just may get it.

Umb, your gonna have to remind me what I asked for ;P

And don't get my other posts wrong, I won't try to tell anyone that it is bad to have nitrous or a blower, I just feel that it is more impressive to make killer power without the help of nitrous or a blower. I also won't argue that it's a lot cheaper to make that power with nitrous, but I want my power all day long! http://www.chevelles.com/forum/smile.gif

Chris

P.S. I wouldn't whine because somebody beat me with nitrous, because I wouldn't feel bad about losing to a car with it.

I am do ing a 69 SS396 and thinking of putting nitrous on it I was thinking of the under the carb type of plate or something stealthy because I want the car to look completely stock under the hood the rest of my Chevelle is going to look as original as possible but will have a complete Hotchkiss suspension. For me the only reson it would be there is the occasional stop light to stop light run. Like the suspension it is there to increase my desired performance. If I race and win great, if I race and loose great, I had fun and that's what its all about. About the original post i will have to go with Blowers, after all they are big,power makers that use burn gas by gallons per hour and not miles per gallon. What could be more American than that!!

If anyone has any ideas on dong a No2 set up like I would like to have please e-mail me.
Joe Harrison
69ss396@chevelles.com

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Gold Member #164


[This message has been edited by Joe Harrison (edited 07-10-99).]

[This message has been edited by Joe Harrison (edited 07-10-99).]

Truly American= Blower and Nitrous with a gun under the seat.
he,he,hey.
Harley

My vote for most american would be an AMC AMX with the "american flag" paint scheme. with a huge AMC 390 with dual supers with dual carbs and foggers and twin turbos hanging off the headers, which of course go through the hood. this car should have tiny little 12x2 front wheels and 60" slicks out back... it should be packing a 4 speed rock-box and something near 5.88 rears. It should have ladder bars and a cage and should idle like a wet dog!

And it should have a "**** Happens" bumper sticker and be blaring "Freebird".

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Francis Taracido
Sniper0666@aol.com
Proud Patron of Quadzilla
http://members.aol.com/sniper0666/page/index.html

Not everyone can afford to build some crazy motor that can run 9's on the motor. And it doesn't matter how you loose, you can't make excuses afterwards. And you think that other guy cares how you feel about it. If you try and make excuses, "oh! you used nitrous so that doesn't count". That guy will laugh at you even more. "HAHA, what a sore loser. I still beat you".

I hate the stigma that follows nitrous. If you have it, even when you don't use it people try and say you did. And they think your car is only fast on the nitrous. I hate sore losers. Mostly punks in trashed out imports.

Back to the topic at hand. Being American is about WINNING! Being bigger, faster, and louder! We like to show off. We like being the best. And we don't make excuses(except for politicians). So whatever you want, blower or nitrous is ok by me.

Because going fast IS looking good.

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David Nafarrete
Team Chevelle Gold
1965 406 6speed
(almost on the road again)

Been a while for me, but when I used to hang out with the crowd that street raced, allowances were haggled over like a land deal. You looked over the guys ride, made your calculations, and gave X number of car lengths to the guy who supposedly had the dis-advantage. If you guessed wrong, you lost. Seems to me that nitrous would be the same way. Hidden nitrous, used to win real money or more, would be cause for a butt kicking, in my book. As long as it is up front, let the best man/machine win.
John Walker

Wes V was very close historically. But the first to use Nitrous in an internal combustion engine was the German Luftwafe in WWII. It seems they squeezed their Mesherscmidts to outrun the British Royal Airforce during dogfights. The Germans can have all the credit... We'll take the win, thank you very much.

First; please explain to me what "American" is and what you mean by it.
From that Continent ?? Invented there??
Far too P.C. for me to tackle.

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Gotta have a Chevy !

blowers rule,nos is fake horsepower,any one can have it.takes more witts to run a blower.a gun under the seat is all american. UP THE IRONS! 67rat member #199

I think you have it backwards Rat. I like them both but speaking from experience. A blower is a no brainer to tune for.

Aug98, you're either very good or very lucky. I've talked to many who had a hard time dialing in their blowers.

BTW a pilot friend of mine said that the Germans were also the first to use blowers on their high altitude planes.

Harley and Rat, HUUUUWAH. My nice old SuperBlackhawk 44 maggie under the seat! Unfortuntely,that's becoming un-American.

Vortech08, I have a non-answer to your question. The most American deal I know of realtive to HP is cubes. I mean the Euro/jap cars brag about their 300 CI engines. Geez. MB has their "kompressors" and now we've established that the Germans were first in nitrous and possibly in blowers.

Americans like it BIG. BIG CUBES. Like a "Dallas" Texan cliche.

Last night I took a spin in my buds 509 Camaro. Fresh. Dart Pro 1 heads, solid roller, only 10.5:1 CR , and of course, TRIPOWER!

Vortech, this thing makes the L88 seem like a small block. It's like a 427 on nitrous. I couldn't believe it. I'm bummed in a way cause I thought my L88 would be pretty quick. This thing is absolutley scary. And it's "au naturel".

BTW don't ever take on a Black 68 Camaro cruising around the streets of Rochester NY. It's totally stealth. Nothing sticking out of the hood. Cage is hard to see. And right now it's downright fugley ( no paint, non matching door skin etc. ) Unless you also have 670+hp that makes it to the pavement.

So Vortech08, the real answer to your question might be CUBES!!!

Or as my two year old exclaimed when he saw the motor, " Dat's a big fat big one." Out of the mouths of babes. Yup.



[This message has been edited by Gene Chas (edited 07-14-99).]

Gene, I guess a little of both, I've been doing it all my life. But we are talking street cars and not Pro Mods right? I see more engines damaged due to improper tuning with nitrous than with blowers. True there are more nitrous engines around than blower ones and that may be the reason.
But the blower car (65 Vette) I tune on is a street car with a 406. That dynod at 585 hp. It belongs to a friend of mine and drives it every chance he gets. And about every 3 or 4 months he'll bring it by for me to look at and tune on. You see he's one of those guys that has too much money to do it himself.

BTW with BFG's, mufflers and me feathering it out of the hole (stock rearend) it ran a 11.02 at 129 mph with just a 1.71 60'. Just think of it's potential.

[This message has been edited by Aug98 (edited 07-14-99).]

Yeah, I meant street machines. Jim Oddy's shop is down the road and I guess he also has the knack of dialing these things in for the track.

Almost all of the complaints I've heard have to do with carb jetting.

You hardly have to be Jim Oddy to tune a blower motor, especially one for the street.
Putting it on the dyno takes a lot of the guess work out of what jets to run. And down here in the flat lands where the weather is about the same all year around there's just not much to tune for.

With nitrous you have to change the plugs everytime you go racing to a colder range. And unless you invest in a box (7AL3) like I did you will have to retard your timing everytime. Two things that never change on a blower motor once.

You know the more we discuss this, the more I wish my car had a blower.

P.S. Does Jim have a shop up there too? I beleive he has one somewhere in Florida as well.


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hey heyhey!
im not backwards.you can almost bolt a nos system right on,almost.I install a blower and you can bet I am going to have to tune it to the way I want it to run.which is the best I can get out of it.I think blowers make nos systems look kind of backwards.all that fake horsepower.just my view thats all.
67rat member #199

Define "Fake horsepower" ?!?

Kurt

------------------
The 68 Chevelle info page. [last updated Nov. 30, 98]
www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Garage/6873/Chevelle/68_Chevelle_Info.html (http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Garage/6873/Chevelle/68_Chevelle_Info.html)
Email: Kbyfield@terracom.net
A.C.E.S. #1352

o.k. by field I will explain my version of fake horse power. when ricky racer with his stock 78 buick complete with lights under the rear pulls up and wants to run my 67 L-88 powered chevelle and I take the challenge for kicks and he gives me a good run at top end,I get suspicious!the car would be a powerless piece of sh-t without that bottle.
when asked what e.t. it does he says 13.02 but what would it do with out the bottle? what?maybe 15s.to me this is FAKE HORSEPOWER!yes i had a nos system but I felt it was to easy,I chose to get my horsepower by building a strong big block,much more satisfying.A freind of mine lost 50 bucks to a nos user,who swore he didnt have it,well he found out that he used it to beat him otherwise no contest.well he got his money back,I wont say how,but I know one thing,he did not FAKE it.yes nos is cheap horsepower but I like to make mine naturally!this is just my view of this,I dont want to start an outlash.so there ya go thats my look at FAKE HORSEPOWER. 67rat member #199

No worse than me telling some of the people I race for money that I have a 427. When in fact I have a 540. And I don't trust the next guy anymore than he would trust me. If your going to race for money you need to be prepared to give it all you have cause you better beleive the other guy will. Its all in fun anyway. At least with me it is. What's $50.00 bucks? If you can't afford to lose it and laugh about it, then you shouldn't be doing it.
I race at the track, and on certain nights we have grudge races. I win money and I've lost less, but I have a damn good time either way.
But there is no such thing as fake horsepower. Just guys that take it a little too far. If he said no bottle, then there should of been no bottle. You guys take it too serious.
Around here the saying is "Run what ya brung, and tow what ya blow" no questions asked.

Its all suppose to be for fun anyway. Kind of like playing poker with your buddies.

hey I have fun. my freind did indeed take It to hard.I guess I wont voice my opinion no more. I have a knack for firing people up.dont know all but I know my share.my ears are allways open to opinions.I know there is no such thing as fake horsepower,horsepower is horsepower.no matter how ya get it.ok, Iagree Iagree Iagree!a good day to all! 67rat member #199

Gee, I wish I had all that fake horsepower of, say, Tony Christian, Pat Musi, Nick Scavo, Jimmy Keen, Bob Joysey, Brian Waszak, Gary Rohe, Bob Reigar, Chuckie Samuels and well, you get the point. I guess they like N20 because it is so simple, cheap and easy to use that any dolt can put a dual stage shot of 600hp squeeze on their ride without understanding anything about N20. Hey, I can't wait to tell Nick Scavo that he really isn't all that good because he is just using fake horsepower. I'll tell those guys that if they were REALLY good they wouldnt use the juice.
Anyway, I know I sound sarcastic and I don't mean to flame anyone. Like I said above, I don't care how people make power, as long as they have a quick clean car, I respect their abilities. Again, sorry about the sarcasm..don't mean to offend anyone but horsepower is horsepower.
I just watched a TV show where they said our new military chopper will have a motor that makes 3000 horsepower and only weighs 300 lbs. Would that be fake horsepower? Sounds awesome to me.
I am reminded that a lot of car guys don't like jet powered dragsters and in fact a lot of sanctioning bodies tell the jet guys to limit their mph "or else". A jet guy told me, jets are faster but the powers that be don't consider them "real" cars and they don't want the fans to realise that the jets are way faster than the cars. So they are relegated to exhibition duty w/ imposed mph limits. My attitude? I do'nt care. I say let em rip and let the best man win no matter how they make power. After all, I think a Top Fuel is no more a car than any jet car is...
Again, horsepower is horsepower, I like all of it..

My my, but we digress! Aug98, you should've piped up about the cube issue. Man, I thought my buds Camaro flat out ripped with the 427, the 509 is so much faster. Your 540 is gotta be something.

This is one of the reason I chose to stay orignal/nostaligia. A 67 SS with a 67 L88. If I didn't I'd be building a $5000+ 540. No substitute for cubes man, none. Why do Christian and co run 600+ ci rats?

Oddy started up here in Buffalo, which on the racing circuit is kind of a backwater. Nothing much happening here. Now he has two shops, here and in FLA. Not much $$$ here, so I'm sure the market for blown boat motors is 10X bigger in FLA.

Vortech08, so what do this of this immigrants son's answer to your "Yankee Horsepower" debate? Cubic Inches Baby!That's American!

Gene go back and look at Aug 98's feature car and you will see my grocery getter. Boy I wish Oddy was my neighbor. I'd be peaking in his windows all the time. What a thread. Might as well be talking politics.

Mike Hurta
(Aug98)

MB has their "kompressors" on ... 2.3 liter engines... go figure.. quite a lot of them in here, tho.

Germans had kompressors in their monster pre WWII race cars also. Germans have always been very "techy"..

Gun? Bullet-proof windows might be better?

Gene, you do not need to preach me about cubes, man! I think you know me better than that... 540 is minimum for me, hope for a 610+

That would melt street tires breathing free, but BBC is not complete without a big blower, IMO. It would be just .. an engine.

The blower´s looks, sounds and power is too much to resist. To see the other side of 1000 horses... Monster overkill... forget original SS, of course, i would never screw up an original SS...

I think that a big V8 with a xy-71 and carbs is just about as american you can get, cuz no other country has such stuff. (Seen a 560 MB with a 6-71 tho http://www.chevelles.com/forum/smile.gif )

Of course, can install a NOS between the carbs and blower, just for the show...

Gene, go tell Oddy that i said hi, will ya! His work is appreciated across the pond also!
Does he still race that pro-mod Vette?

vortech08
europe

Mr. Hurta, nice friggin' ride. Wheels up!