MODERATOR,I POSTED THIS IN THE PERF & ENGINE FORUMS TO ENSURE MORE TCR'S RUNNING FLAT TAPPET CAMS SEE THIS INFO SO PLEASE DONT DELETE IT.

THANKS...SCOTT
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Guys,Here are 3 grades of conventional oil mfg by LUBRIPLATE that have pelnty of Zn & P to protect our flat tappet cams.

They are on 30wt/10w-30/15w-40 grades .

Thwe oil dist also gave me data for his Penrite 20w-50 Classic Car Motor oil which is just shy of where we would like to see the ZDDP #s. But stp in red bottle or some EOS should boost that up to a safe lvl for mild valve spring pressures use with a mild perf cam.

He also offers a 15w-60(yes 60) Penrite Classic car oil that is just about where it should be esp if you want to be safe by adding 1 bottle of red stp to boost the Zn & P lvl a little. but i think your ok without the additional Zn & P with mild cam/spring pressures.

The distributor sells them online as buy it now in ebay,for orm his website,and from a phone order desk. His name/address/company name/website/and order phone # iare all listed below the 1st note pasted below showing the ZDDP lvl's in each of the 3 grades of oil.

So read the 1st note to see the Zn & P data on some of the oils he offers along with all his contact & website/order info below the Zn & P test data.

Then there is a 2nd note from the oil distributor that answers the question that no other mfg has answered for me yet which was are the ZDDP #'s you gave me for your Lubriplate super GPO & Pentire oils obtained from oil mfg & tested post 1/2007 to ensure its current ZDDP data which he stated we were ok on so check that out too.

So check this oil & info out and his website and let me & other t/cr's know what you guys think of it.

Scott

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NOTE #1:

Hi Scott and thanks for the reply. Here is Zn & P test info I got from
> lubriplate that shows the Super GPO series is where you want it.
> it shows the following:
>
> GPO 10w-30 average over 2 samples, P=1176 ppm (0.1176%) Zn=1326ppm Ca=2322ppm
> GPO 15w-40 average over 5 samples, P=1199 ppm Zn=1288ppm Ca=2474ppm
> GPO 30 average over 1 sample, P=1248 Zn= 1249 Ca=2472

Here is the Zn & P info on the Penrite 20w-50, Zn=900ppm and p=700pp,it's lower then what you wanted.

Penrite 15w-60(yes 60) oil shows approx 1150ppm Zn & P,very cose to what you wanted.

> Thank you,
>
> Tony Teravainen
> Restoration Supply Company
order desk 800-306-7008
office 760-741-4014
cell 760-505-2670
fax 760-739-8843
www.RestorationStuff.com
Oils are sold on ebay too as "buy it nows".
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NOTE #2;

Scott,concerning the super GPO & Penrite oils,,they ran the lot numbers of the samples tested for Zn & P and they were all manufactured & tested post Jan 2007,thats good for all of us.

Thank you,

Tony Teravainen

Have I ever deleted the results of your research before? I'm glad you are willing to take the time to sort through the BS claims of the oil companies.

No Tom,you never deleted my oil info posts but i just wanted to let you now why i dbl posted just to be safe.

Thanks...scott

i have a question. i am a marine tech and was wondering what the mercury marine 25w40 mercruiser oil would have for additives. as most of these engines are still flat tappet cams. which are made to run 5000 rpm all day. is there a way to find out what the additive package is like you have on other oils?

I had some Mercury Marine inboard & sterndrive 25W-40 (part no. 92-858048Q01) tested this summer. It showed 1587 ppm zinc, 1299 ppm phosphorus and calcium-magnesium (detergents) combined just under 2000 ppm.

Thank You for the information and all of the hard work and research. It is greatly appreciated.

My boss uses Super GPO in his diesel mercedes. He has a few new quarts on the shelf i should take one and get it tested just for piece of mind.

Thank You for the information and all of the hard work and research. It is greatly appreciated.

thanx, also what are we looking for in minimum numbers? so we have a ballpark starting line?

LEO,dont forget to shake/aggitate the container of oil just prior to pouring out a sample of the GPO oil to be sent out for testing or you may not get a proper test result and please post the results from that oil test and what lab performed the test. It would also be good to find out how long ago he bought the oil and from where to ensure its been mfg post 1/2007 . I ask this to ensure you get data on oil recently mfg and not data on oil mfg 1 yr or more ago which could be misleading or not representative of whats being mfg today esp when it comes to Zn & P lvl's. Lastly,what grade/wt GPO oil does your boss use in his diesel?

WILLIAM,the rec ballpark zddp lvl to protect flat tappet perf cams with higher spring rates per the LN oil rept done earlier this yr is approx .12%-.14%/1200ppm-1400ppm Zn & P. But from what i have a read very mild spring rates on stock or mild perf flat tappet cams are ok with slightly lower ZDDp lvl's then rec for the higher spring rates. What that lvl is i dont know for sure but if i had to take a stab at it i would think your ok with 1000pp-1200ppm Zn & P for those applications.

GARY,on MERCURY MARINE 15-40,i looked all over the site months back and could not get the zddp data,i contacted them mult times but they would not give me a resp or any zddp data so i tried at the time but they were just not responsive at all.

You said you were a marine/tech ,well why is that oil marketed for STERN DRIVES ?

Does that mean it meant for stern drives only and is not designed for use in motors or does it mean its designed for motors with stern drives on them?

So thanks for posting the zddp data for whicked looked good but unless you can get confirmation that the oil you had tested was mfg post 2007 i would not rely/trust the zddp data at all IMHO.

Thats because i found early on when reaserching this zddp/oil stuff that the people at the oil mfg's were reffering to old/out dated zddp data in some cases. So unless you can confirm the oil sample you personally sent out for testing was in fact mfg post 1/2007 i would not be rec it to people to use to protect flat tappet cams even though it may be ok,we just dont know that for yet unless you get a sample tested of that oil known to be mfg post 1/2007. I highly doubt Mercury mfg's it and who knows where they get it from and with all the ongoing changes that are going on in the oil industry and EPA these days on a farily regular bassis without the public knowing i would not trust any zddp data over a yr old.

I would even ask for the zddp data on this Lubriplate & Penrite oil i have posted the zddp info on at least 1x yrly (even though was verified to be zddp #'s from oil that was mfg post 1/2007 ) to ensure the zddp lvl's have not been reduced without our being told like has already happened throughout the entire oil industry.

scott

Scott,

Thank you for your hard work and efforts on this subject. It is greatly appreciated.

I love the solid ft in my sbc, and I dread having to take it out and replace it with a roller. It is not the work I dread, it is the cost, and the possible change of character the engine has currently. Thanks again.

GUY'S,thanks for the kind words,esp since i have put so much time into this and still am,i appreciate it.

I am doing this oil/ZDDP research stuff for all of us here in t/chevelle that are running flat tappet cams.

I am glad to see that Lubriplate & Penrite have have some oils at this time that can do the job so we dont have to switch to full syn oil that be leak prone i our older motors not designed for it.

We can also run some EOS/STP RED BOTTLE/CRANE SUPER LUBE ENGINE BREAKIN LUBE with std motor oil thats low on ZDDP to boost it up a smidge too.

But you can bet i will contact the Lubriplate/Penrite oil dist approx 1x yrly so he can ask the mfg from an oil distributor's standpoint for new updated ZDDP data or for some confirmation that the ZDDP lvl has not been reduced over the past yr which i cant get.

Scott

LEO,dont forget to shake/aggitate the container of oil just prior to pouring out a sample of the GPO oil to be sent out for testing or you may not get a proper test result and please post the results from that oil test and what lab performed the test. It would also be good to find out how long ago he bought the oil and from where to ensure its been mfg post 1/2007 . I ask this to ensure you get data on oil recently mfg and not data on oil mfg 1 yr or more ago which could be misleading or not representative of whats being mfg today esp when it comes to Zn & P lvl's. Lastly,what grade/wt GPO oil does your boss use in his diesel?
scott

Scott,

I checked tonight and my boss had 10w-30 at the shop and i want 15w-40 so i ordered a case today.

I'll send a sample out for testing after i recieve the package just because.... If it doesn't pass i'll just add some EOS.

Leo,thanks very much for the reply and please let me/us here in t/chevelle know how the oil test comes out for ZDDP & detergent along with what lab tested it for you.

Also,please test both the 15w-40 & 10w-30 if you can,dont forget to shake bottles well prior to pouring samples.

Thanks....scott

ttt

Ordered on 10/10 and received my case today 10/12, fast shipping !!

Pasted below is a little more oil info i got from Castrol when i asked for the Zn & P lvls in thier GTX 20w-50 conventional oil. We have been told the the ZDDP reductions are generally for the lighter oils but here is proof of just what i had been stating in the past that the zinc & P reductions havd also affected the heavier grades too as stated bt casrtol rep pasted below the dbl line .

But this is not the full syn 20w-50 that was recently re-formulated/boosted with Zinc & P for classic cars that has a min of 1200ppm ZDDP which is ok for flat tappet cams which i was also just re-stated by the castrol rep pasted below.

Scott
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Unfortunately the information you are requesting in proprietary. The Castrol
GTX 20W-50 has had a reduction of zinc and is not recommended to be used in Classic
cars with flat tappet cams.

Although the exact amount of zinc is proprietary, the level of Zinc in the
new re-formualted full synthetic Syntec 20W-50 is a minimum of 1200 ppm, which will provide excellent anti-wear protection for the cam and lifters in a flat-tappet cam engine.


Castrol Consumer Relations

GUYS/HERE IS AN UPDATE ON Lubriplate GPO 15w-40 that was tested by Blackstone which i just sent to the oil distributor that provided me with the ZDDP info from Lubriplate which i recently passed on to all of you.

Could be better/could be worse but really doesnt surprise me as just about none of the oils i have seen tested this yr meet the P & Zn lvl's the mfg's state is in them.

SCOTT
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Hi Tony,one of the our club members had the Lubriplate GPO 15w-40 oil tested for Zn & P by an independent lab and the results were significantly less then what Lubrplates #'s were. This is enough of an issue to be marginal with a non stock perf flat tappet cam with elevated valve spring pressures and thought you should know this for future refference. I think for stock to very mild flat tappet cam'd motors it's ok but it's marginal for higher perf flat tappet cam'd motors with high spring rates.

But on the possitive side one small hit of GM EOS would do the trick and this oil also has less detergent that are more in line with standard pass car oils then most diesel oils i had seen tested which is also a good thing when using it in gasoline motors .

Here are the lubriplate #'s for the gpo 15w-40 and then open the below note to view the lab test results.

(To restate the rec amount of Zn & P for perf flat tappet cams is 1200ppm-1400ppm/.12%-.14% - P & Zn )

Lubriplate GPO 15w-40 average over 5 samples, P=1199 ppm Zn=1288ppm Ca=2474ppm

Blackstone lab test rept results for P & Zn were P=835 ppm Zn=1030ppm Ca=2540ppm.

At 1st i thought maybe the lab test was not accurate but then i realized that there was only approx 2% variation from the test lab result for detegent and Lubriplates detergent #'s so that says to me that Blackstone SEEMS to be measuing accurate within in reasonable tollerances.

Lab = 2540ppm & Lubriplate = 2474ppm for detergent which is a small expected variation with this type testing which shows the labs testing was accurate to me.

Scott