Just got done working on a good customers car. The car is a '68-72 Pontiac Lemans with a .070" over 454. The customer hurt the engine so we took it out, had the block sleeved and rebuilt it so he can sell the car.

Whomever he bought the car from built it and it has a set of large tube hooker headers. I didn't measure, but they are larger than my 2" Hookers. I'd say they were either 2 1/8", not sure if they were 2 1/4" or not. Much too large for his combination with one tube going around the frame on the outside.

The engine had Marlin rect port heads also and plug access was horrible. On the passenger side the two rear plugs were quite a challenge to R&R.

The drivers side was worse in that cylinders #3 & 5 you couldn't get a socket on without risking breaking the precelin off. I wound up having to completely unbolt the header to do those two plugs.

The car also had a Nippondenso starter and with the electrical connections on the outside, the car builder smashed on header tube 50% flat to give clearance for the starter 7 wires. Many of the tubes were dented and beat to get them to fit, yet no dings/dents for plug access. :mad:

Another good customer has a '71-72 El Camino with big tube hookers with A/C and several plugs on that thing are almost impossible to access. #8 plug is the worst.

Cripes, why does Hooker sell such junk when it's pretty clear they don't fit properly, and you cannot access the plugs to save your life? :confused:

Todd I had those headers on my car. They are the 2 1/8 headers. And yes I broke many plugs also. I didn't do a lot of plug reads at the track for fear of breaking plugs.

Have the same things on our 67, and several of the tubes are massaged down to almost a laughable amount. Doesn't seem to hurt performance though. :)

Cut down a plug socket, it makes getting in there MUCH easier. Use a wrench on the backside and they come out pretty easily.

Must be the specific body style...I've had Hooker 2 1/8" Super Comps on my '70 for 4 years. Plug changes, filter changes and starter clearances are great...no issues. Even with a kicked out Molodon pan.
The Hookers are the version where one pipe on each side goes out around the frame before joining the collector.

If the heads have raised exhuast ports it really makes plug changing far more difficult. The same headers with normal exhausts can be easy.
My new heads raised the exhuast .600 and it put 3 plugs right into the path of the tubes.

Cripes, why does Hooker sell such junk when it's pretty clear they don't fit properly, and you cannot access the plugs to save your life? :confused:
I think BillK has said it many times; because people keep buying the junk. Instead of sending them back because they don't fit, just wail on them with a hammer to make them fit - then complain how crappy they are.:confused:

Hmmm.. I have Hookers on my Big block 68 Chevelle with raised runner heads. The only thing they didnt clear was the stock proportioning valve. It was a minor adjustment. Plug changes are not easy but not that difficult either. I also have a stock starter with no issues there. I have seen much worse. I have had several different brands of headers on different Chevelles and on this one over the years. By far the best fitting were Flowtechs on my old 327.

I think BillK has said it many times; because people keep buying the junk. Instead of sending them back because they don't fit, just wail on them with a hammer to make them fit - then complain how crappy they are.:confused:

LOL Isn't that the way it is!

I think its impossible to install headers (even ones that fit) without scratching or dinging them at least a little bit -- as a result i think people have it in their minds that they can't return headers that won't fit because they scratched or dinged them during a failed install attempt.

I have had similar experience with Hooker 1-3/4" and 1-5/8" SBC headers in 1st gen Camaro. Although I will say that their 1-7/8" headers fit great in my friend's 69 and have good plug access too.

It's hit or miss with Hooker IMO.

Well my 400 dollar Dart intake didnt fit either until I machined it, and Had to open up the throat just so the butterflies would open.

I asked someone at Hooker if they were planning on revising their design for my 210 AFR's. The reply was: "We aren't changing our design for one set of heads." DOH!!!

I called S&S, and they said they didn't know if theirs would fit, but would try to find a car with AFR 210 heads, to see if they would fit. They called back 3 days later, and said they would fit. I didn't buy the S&S headers, but at least they were willing to answer my question. S&S makes "no name" headers for places like Summit. If you are going to order headers with the mindset that, if they don't fit or look good, you will send them back, maybe you should give them a try. They seemed like good poeple to work with.

Anyone have experience with their headers??

4 SETS OF HOOKERS AND ALL FIT...
plugs(some) needed a wrench to get out.. but..

The 2" Hedmans on the Chevelle fit good with good plug access and ground clearance,the 1 3/4" Hookers were o.k.,a couple plugs were tough and they hung down too low and were flattened on the bottom,when the sbc was in the 1 5/8"Flowtechs were too low also,plugs 5 & 6 were tough,needed a wrench,have some sbc 1 3/4"Hookers with good plug clearance but wouldn't clear the cross member,unknown application though,think Camaro/Nova.SBC 1 5/8" Hookers on the truck have bad plug clearance on 5 & 6,not so good on 3 & 4,wire/boot routing is a pain and they are also flattened out,but the truck is pretty low.

If the heads have raised exhuast ports it really makes plug changing far more difficult. The same headers with normal exhausts can be easy.
My new heads raised the exhuast .600 and it put 3 plugs right into the path of the tubes.

x2

I've experienced it with the Merlin heads. Raised ports moved headers that fit fine with OEM heads to be a PITA.

I'm glad this topic came up again. I just finished firing off a heated email to Holley about the set of Super Comps that I bought for my '72 Chevelle. The Canfield heads with raised exhaust ports made the headers totally worthless. With the amount of rebuilding I had to do, I would have been further ahead just building my own.

Holley is no doubt aware of this problem, it would be nice if they would mention it in their application guides. I agree that the best solution is to start returning headers that don't fit.

Tom

I think BillK has said it many times; because people keep buying the junk. Instead of sending them back because they don't fit, just wail on them with a hammer to make them fit - then complain how crappy they are.:confused:I have these same headers on my 70 Chevelle, and I also had to dimple them in 5 places on the drivers side and one place on the passenger side. I bought them from Summit racing, and not directly from Hooker. I don't even think that Hooker deals directly with the public, so it wouldn't matter if I sent them back to Summit Racing or not.

But I needed atleast 2 1/8" primary tubes for my engine, and Hooker is the only one who makes off-the-shelf headers that big. They're half the price of custom headers and that's with ceramic coating included, so unless I wanted to spend atleast $1200 for headers, and then still have to get them ceramic coated after that, then I didn't have any choice but to buy the Hookers and deal with them. But I do have a tall deck block along with raised exhaust ports. the plugs were challenging, but they weren't that bad since I have the Accel shorty plugs, and i also purchased a special tool that works great for this. if I can find the website, then I'll post the link later on.

Go to www.Powerhouseproducts.com

and in the search menu box type in POW301150 and you'll see the coolest tool for changing sparkplugs on problem headers. it works great.

After all these years of complaints why hasn't some other company come about to fill the gap? No competition for Hooker means they have no reason to change their product or provide good, basic customer service. I see this on Pontiac motors, too.

It's not that they are made crappy, because they are not. It's that they tell they will fit applications where they won't fit. They know, that if they're close, you will get the hammer out to make them work, rather than spend the time and trouble to return them.

As I said above, I couldn't get over their reluctance to change the design for the AFR's, one of the most popular heads, and stick with a 40 year old design. Doesn't sound like they want to stay in the header business.

Go to www.Powerhouseproducts.com

and in the search menu box type in POW301150 and you'll see the coolest tool for changing sparkplugs on problem headers. it works great.http://www.compperformancegroupstores.com/store/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=PH&Product_Code=POW301150&Category_Code=

http://www.compperformancegroupstores.com/store/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=PH&Product_Code=POW301150&Category_Code=

yep, that's them...I couldn't get my PC at work here to copy and paste that direct link. Thanks. :thumbsup: I have these tools, and they work better than any standard socket or wrench ever will. Hooker headers fit poorly on my engine, and I knew that they would fit bad, but I didn't know how bad. And I'm just not into spending $1,400 for parts and ceramic coating labor, for one custom made set of tubes, or $2,500 for the other brand of custom made tubes. I'm not knocking anyone for doing that, but I can think of a whole lot of better things to spend over a grand on for my car. If anyone has those expensive ones on their car, then more power to em. But it just isn't for me right now. Maybe in the future, I'll change my mind on that. I dunno.

But for $500 for the headers, and another couple hundred extra for the ceramic coating, it was worth it to me to take a shot at the Hookers.

I've got the Super Comps 2 1/8 in my 69 and access and clearance is great for plugs, filter, steering, etc. Very happy.

Why do some fit well and some don't? It sounds like it might be a matter of head mfg., block mfg., and chassis combo.

I'm glad this topic came up again. I just finished firing off a heated email to Holley about the set of Super Comps that I bought for my '72 Chevelle. The Canfield heads with raised exhaust ports made the headers totally worthless. With the amount of rebuilding I had to do, I would have been further ahead just building my own.

Holley is no doubt aware of this problem, it would be nice if they would mention it in their application guides. I agree that the best solution is to start returning headers that don't fit.

Tom

LETS SEE YOU BUY HEADERS THAT ARE NOT made for raised ports... and it's their fault..
they don't fit..

thats like buy'n headers for angle plug heads for a straight plug headed engine..
and wondering why they are a pita....

and if the info. isn't in their "app guide"
it's only a call away, to find out if they'll fit raised ports...
but that require you to call a 1-800 phone #..
and spend some time on hold..
lott's easier than try'n to force them to fit...
don't ya think

and if the info. isn't in their "app guide"
it's only a call away, to find out if they'll fit raised ports...
but that require you to call a 1-800 phone #..
and spend some time on hold..
lott's easier than try'n to force them to fit...
don't ya think

Not all of us are as "enlightened" as you seem to be. When I bought the headers I had no idea that some heads had raised exhaust ports. A simple note in the application guide would have raised some suspicion and save me and a lot of others a lot of trouble...don't ya think?

Tom

I think there may be alot of factors involved before someone calls a part junk. The application must match, if a motor has been swapped how can the manufacturer be held responsible for the fit? Additionally, every Hooker header set I have recieved new has an installation sheet that identifies specifics that are required for installation from motor lifting to banging a tube for proper clearance. Hooker headers, unlike most off the shelf headers, are tuned, meaning the tubes are all the same diameter and length running into a specific size collector. try sticking the same size tubes in each body style and motor combination that can be made and you are bound to have tubes running outside the frame to the collector. I personally don't think there is anything wrong with their product and have no problem using them but i always try to make sure I get the right selection otherwise it's noone's fault but my own if they don't fit right. take it easy Andy

Made in Mexico...That's what I saw (13 years ago) when I bought my Super Comps 1 3/4" for my SBC (383) Chevelle. Made me upset after spending all that money to see that and wrote to them (before they were acquired) and only thing I got was a sales guy that tried selling me some aero mufflers, WTH?!? So, I won't buy them again.

As for fit, they worked, but damn were they tight and a juggle to get in there. The quality is *OK*, but they don't live up to their previous reputation, imo...Performance wise, I suppose they're alright, but like I said, won't buy them again.

Just for you guys that want to use Powerhouse tools the people on the phone are like going to Checkers can't tell you S%#t and you are sent to comp cams tech line which is just as bad. You have to know what you want and ask no questions. Just my experience.

Not all of us are as "enlightened" as you seem to be. When I bought the headers I had no idea that some heads had raised exhaust ports. A simple note in the application guide would have raised some suspicion and save me and a lot of others a lot of trouble...don't ya think?

Tom

MIGHT HELP IF YOU KNOW WHAT YOU GOT BEFORE ORDERING THEM...

Not all of us are as "enlightened" as you seem to be. When I bought the headers I had no idea that some heads had raised exhaust ports. A simple note in the application guide would have raised some suspicion and save me and a lot of others a lot of trouble...don't ya think?

Tom

So you bought a set of heads and didn't know they had raised ports? And now you think the header manufacturer should inform the uninformed about raised port heads? Geez.:wacko: Maybe you should have a clue about the parts you are buying? Just a thought.

Just for you guys that want to use Powerhouse tools the people on the phone are like going to Checkers can't tell you S%#t and you are sent to comp cams tech line which is just as bad. You have to know what you want and ask no questions. Just my experience.I believe that I bought them online, so I didn't have any need to talk to them over the phone. there's only one set of these that they sell, and I've already given you the part number, so I don't believe there was any reason for you to ask questions. I know what you mean about telephone people hired to deal with customers being anything but helpful and knowledgeable though. Unfortunately there are a lot of businesses that hire people like this.

I don't like it anymore than you do, but look at it this way, would you take a job that involves nothing but taking telephone orders all day and being on the phone answering would-be customers' questions? I sure wouldn't. And I'm sure that jobs like that don't pay much either. So the type of people in the workforce who will take those jobs probably aren't the most educated, nor the most articulate individuals anyway. Unless it's a small mom & pop biz or family owned business where the people who designed the parts are the same ones answering the phone.

Billy G. I went on line and saw some other things that I was interested in and there was a choice between 3 or 4 different models of the same tool and I wanted to get more info on the differences and they were lost(and the 15 min wait on Comp tech line) . It is a great link, sorry if it came across wrong.

Billy G. I went on line and saw some other things that I was interested in and there was a choice between 3 or 4 different models of the same tool and I wanted to get more info on the differences and they were lost(and the 15 min wait on Comp tech line) . It is a great link, sorry if it came across wrong.No harm, no foul my friend. I share you frustration when it comes to trying to deal with so called sales people or tech people from many of these aftermarket companies. I've been equally frustrated when I've tried to get specific answers from so called "tech" people from Comp cams, Lunati cams, World castings/Bill Mitchell, and the list goes on and on....

I agree with you that it really shouldn't be that way, and I don't like it either. I just didn't realize that you were speaking of a different part than the one that I was speaking of. That makes a little more sense now that you've explained it. I just meant that it shouldn't stop anyone from getting that tool, because for less than perfect headers, it really does work fanatastic.