Im changing my long water pump, pass side alt. configuration over to the correct setup. I have the water pump, PS res. and pump and alt. What bracket(s) do i need for the PS and Alternator for the driver side setup?

68 chevelle BB

i thought they went to the long pump setup in 68?
or was that just on small blocks?

68 was the last year for the short pump, remot PS reservoir. but i have no reference. IM unclear on what parts i need.

BB was SWP in '68.

I am currently running a DS alternator and PS with a LWP on my '68. I put mine together using Alan Grove Components brackets for both and stock (well repro) chrome pulleys.

Now I am planning on going to SWP as well for more electric fan clearance and have done some research on this setup.

It turns out the factory setup for SWP on BB was unique to the Chevelle and used a one-off power steering pump with a remote fill reservoir. This was mounted on a long mount that hung the PS pump out over the top of the steering gear. I saw one of these in a car recently and it is one strange looking setup. Part of the magic here was to run the PS off of an add-on pulley out front and then thread the ALT belt between PS pulley and PS body to the rear groove on the crank pulley. I have seen this bracket available as a repro, but I do not plan on using it.

If you want the original restoration approach... you can stop reading here ;)

As mentioned I used Alan Grove brackets and they also make brackets for the SWP setup. In fact they appear to use the exact same metal plate pieces for the ALT bracket only with different spacers and bolts. So I plan on cutting my existing spacers down as needed for both PS brackets and ALT brackets. Rather than run the ALT on the rear groove I will run it on the middle groove of the crankshaft pulley. This will allow me to use a 2-groove PS pump pulley to get the ALT belt around the PS pump in the more normal inside location. It also means I will need to run an aluminum crank pulley so that all grooves are of the same diameter (side affect: 1:1 water pump drive ratio rather than 1:1.2). One detail that I will have to change, and have yet to figure out, is the PS pump tensioner mount.

Later when I get there I will run the A/C on the rear crankshaft pulley groove. Here again the Alan Grove SWP and LWP brackets appear to use the same bracket plates with different spacers.

BTW I have a set of repro chrome alternator mount brackets off Ebay if you are interested.

ALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL 68 Chevelles with a V8 (ANY V8) had the short water pump.
ALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL 69 Chevelles with a V8 had the long water pump.
Up to 68, the alt was on the left side (mounted to the ex manifold on SBs), and the AC compressor was on the right side.
In 1969, Chevrolet got stupid and swapped sides with the AC compressor and the alternator. I have no clue what happened to the Chevy engineers' brains, but they sure went brain dead. And I say Chevy engineers instead of GM engineers because the AC compressor stayed on the CORRECT (right) side on Olds! Ever try to pull the engine from a 69-later Chevelle with air cond???????????

I always wondered why they switch sides myself. Really seemed backwards with the main electrical system bus on the DS and the AC box on the PS.

But after looking at the Chevelle BB PS pump setup... my guess is that the PS pump on the DS took precedence which then drove the ALT to the PS for a compact form factor. Finally leaving no place for the AC compressor but the DS.

At the risk of hijacking this thread, I wonder what is involved in moving the AC Compressor to the passenger side (and the alternator to the driver side) on a 71 small block.

At the risk of hijacking this thread, I wonder what is involved in moving the AC Compressor to the passenger side (and the alternator to the driver side) on a 71 small block.

New mounting brackets for the ALT, PS, and AC compressor.
New shorter and rerouted AC hoses
Electrical wiring modifications to get power cable and exciter/sense wires to ALT in completly different spot.

If you really wanna do this I would check Alan Grove Components as they may have the exact brackets to do this non-standard configuration. They do have the widest variety of configurations I have seen anywhere.

There could also be a route that would also include/require all new crankshaft and water pump pulleys and a short water pump.

You need 4 brackets for the short water pump set-up. The lower bracket, and the adjuster bracket for the ps pump, and upper and lower brackets for the alt.

Chris, do you have an assembly manual? If you don't then you ought to get one.
These part numbers are from the assy manual, they may have changed.
Alt bracket-upper 3884508
Alt bracket-lower 3925526
Spacer 3831946
P/S upper bracket 3925528
P/S lower bracket (cradle) 3925527
Stud 3928906

Of course, you'll need the nuts and bolts to put it all together, that's where the assembly manual will come in handy. Page N40,A11 and page 6,A5
Most of the restoration suppliers, (Year One, Hinshaw's, Ground Up) can sell you what you need, usually in a kit.
Hope that helped,
BillL

Thanks for the help guys. I found what i needed at a local shop that specializes in 67-72 CHevy trucks... at least, he says he has the parts i need. I noticed on my buddys 4X4 truck, the PS setup and alt looked the same (454 )

ALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL 68 Chevelles with a V8 (ANY V8) had the short water pump.
ALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL 69 Chevelles with a V8 had the long water pump.
Up to 68, the alt was on the left side (mounted to the ex manifold on SBs), and the AC compressor was on the right side.


(bolding done by me)

the 100% original and unmolestered 307 powered 68 Chevelle Nomad station wagon i had back in '95 had a long water pump with the alt on the passenger side. i know it was all original because the protective layer of grease was uniform from the rear of the block to the tip of the water pump, no wires were ever spliced, and the car only had like 40,000 miles on it. i think the plug wires, cap, and belt were all original.
i've got a pic of the engine somewhere.

Tom has the correct information regarding chevelles, camaros, novas and passenger cars. The trucks retained the SWP through 72. Chris the brackets will be the same, but the exit location of the return line on the PS pump for a chevelle exits in a different place than on the truck. If you have A/C, the trucks use a couple extra brackets which the chevelle did not use. The 68 model year also incorporates 1 additional bracket on an A/C compressor not used on 66-67 model years. Also noteworthy the camaro's lower alternator brackets and PS brackets differ from a chevelle with a SWP because the Camaro did not use a remote PS reservoir. These are chevelle specific

Bill or Ark68, how do i run the belts on a basic setup like mine? alt, PS, fan, and crank.
I just picked up the correct parts today, except for the upper alternator barcket. I got the PS cradle, upper PS adj. bracket and lower Alt bracket. BTW, does the PS adj. bracket go behind the PS and bolt to the first manifold bolt? thats the only way i can see to mount it.

http://search.ebay.com/1968-Chevelle-assembly-manual_W0QQ_trksidZm37QQfromZR40QQssPageNameZRC002 1

Buy the book, pleeeeze; I promise, you'll be happy you did.;) It has pictures and part numbers for all this stuff. It's less than $30 and worth 10x that.

The back belt goes over the crank, water pump and alternator. You'll need the lower pulley for the P/S that bolts to the front of your current pulley (if it's a factory short water pump crank pulley).
The front exhaust manifold bolt is replaced by a special stud that tightens the manifold and the adjuster bracket is attached to it. The P/S belt goes around the crank pulley and the P/S pump only.
Pulley numbers-
http://www.chevelles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=160018
BillL
BillL

THanks Ark, i have the book SOMEWHERE... but cant locate it when i need it.
The current pulley i have on the PS is a double groove pulley. Would that work? In your pics it looks like you have a single groove that sits a lot more forward than mine. Ill get it figured out. Just glad to finally get it setup right.
I assume i can ask for 68 chevelle belts instead of guessing like i used to do with the weird setup it had?

http://search.ebay.com/1968-Chevelle-assembly-manual_W0QQ_trksidZm37QQfromZR40QQssPageNameZRC002 1

Buy the book, pleeeeze; I promise, you'll be happy you did.;)
BillL

I HIGHLY agree.

(bolding done by me)

the 100% original and unmolestered 307 powered 68 Chevelle Nomad station wagon i had back in '95 had a long water pump with the alt on the passenger side. i know it was all original because the protective layer of grease was uniform from the rear of the block to the tip of the water pump, no wires were ever spliced, and the car only had like 40,000 miles on it. i think the plug wires, cap, and belt were all original.
i've got a pic of the engine somewhere.

Either it wasn't original or it wasn't a 68. Maybe a 69? Go to any parts store and order a water pump for a 68 with a 307 and you'll get a short water pump.

The current pulley i have on the PS is a double groove pulley. Would that work? In your pics it looks like you have a single groove that sits a lot more forward than mine.

The power steering is piggy back/single pulley which bolts on top of the crank pulley. It sticks out farther so it will line up with the power steering pump pulley.

THanks Ark, i have the book SOMEWHERE... but cant locate it when i need it.
The current pulley i have on the PS is a double groove pulley. Would that work? In your pics it looks like you have a single groove that sits a lot more forward than mine. Ill get it figured out. Just glad to finally get it setup right.
I assume i can ask for 68 chevelle belts instead of guessing like i used to do with the weird setup it had?
You are talking about the pulley on the PS pump here right? If so you need a single groove PS pump pulley.

The other thing I have not heard you mention is if you got the special PS pump needed for the SWP BB Chevelle application? It is a one-off unusual setup and the general common PS pump will not work. Just in case you find the prices a bit steep for "real" Chevelle PS pumps, you may be able to substitute a PS pump from a '93 Chevy P30 van as it has the same type of remote fill reservoir setup.

Oh and you will also need the remote reservoir PS fluid tank and feeder hose.

Either it wasn't original or it wasn't a 68. Maybe a 69? Go to any parts store and order a water pump for a 68 with a 307 and you'll get a short water pump.
it was a 68 Chevelle Nomad wagon with a 307 and powerglide trans. rubber floor mat, am radio, on-ac, power drum brakes, and manual steering. but the window on the tail gate was power.
nothing on that car was any different than it was when it left the factory, except for the radial tires. i don't think anything under the hood had ever been so much as touched. perhaps it was a late 68 car that got the 69 accessories or something? i didn't know anything about date codes at that time- nor did i care- but i know it was a 68 and i know it had an original long water pump setup. the grease covering the engine was too uniform and there was no signs of any wiring being moved around at all.

My very early build '69 Corvette came with the short water pump.

My very early build '69 Corvette came with the short water pump.
I thought all corvettes through 72 retained the short pump style, same as the BBC trucks.

i thought vettes had a short water pump all the way up until they switched to the LT1 in 92.

I did get the correct PS pump (just the pump, no reservoir built in). I also found, through the 67-72 truck parrts guy ALL the brackets and pulleys i need. They all fit great but the aftermarket Upper alt bracket is a POS! the top mounting bolt is WAY off. Now Im fighting belts. The two i got today were a bit too short. I have to extend the PS pump out a bit because the filler tube up top starts hitting the bottom of the Alt. If i push the Alt in too far it hits my valve covers... back to exchange the belts for one size bigger....

Ok guys, i have the manual BUT i dont see where the little spacer goes on the PS pump. I can either put it in back or front. I have it in back now and it looks like the PS pump is just a little far forward. Yes, i do have the right crank pulley with the extra PS pulley that bolts on to the front of it AND the single PS pulley.

Also, the book appears to show the Reservoir on the core support just where the left fender meets. Does it go right in that corner?

Also, the book appears to show the Reservoir on the core support just where the left fender meets. Does it go right in that corner?

Yes, the reservoir goes in the corner. One end of the bracket wraps around, and bolts to the back of the left fender, and the other bracket end, bolts right where one of the two bolts go into the top of the radiator support.

There isn't a spacer for the P/S pump. :noway:The spacer goes on the rear of the lower alternator mounting hole to take up the space between the alternator and the bracket.

The P/S pump bolts directly to the cradle and the adjusting bracket via the studs that hold the cover on the pump in the rear, and a bolt into the pump at the lower front of the pump.
I'll admit that the assembly manual isn't very clear about that part of mounting,:( so I looked at my car to be sure.
BillL

oh no, so there is a cover that bolts to the PS pump? RIght now, as is, if i put the pump into the cradle there is about 1/4" space to fill up. Remind yo uthat i bought the pump and it had NOTHING on it. I removed all the old hardware from my old pump which was a small block, reservoir-attached pump. The brackets from the old pump had a little spacer under one of the bolts.
Its like one of the mounting holes on the pump is 'sunk in' and needs a spacer (or some other part I dont know about). Is there another brackets Im missing for the PS pump??

Well i think i have it finally. I had to have a bigger spacer coming from the first header bolt. That got the PS pump out a lot further and out from hitting the Alt.

some blurry photos.

http://www.garsworld.com/pulleys.jpg

http://www.garsworld.com/pulleys2.jpg

http://www.garsworld.com/pulleys3.jpg

Chris...You have the alt mounted to the upper bracket wrong, but other than that, it looks good, although the pictures are a little fuzzy. The alt should mount in front of the bracket, then the bolt goes in from the back.

Thanks for the tip Bill. Thanks for all you help. Ill get that fixed today... AFTER i replace the water pump which has a leak! Its a brand new pump as well.... Leaking right from the rear cover seal.