Does anyone ever do the timing method of just advancing it until it sounds good and stopping when it starts to sound crappy again? Just wondering how that's worked out. That's the way my grandpa does it and a few other guys I know have done it and always seems to do well, though it isn't scientific.

Great way to get WAY TOO MUCH advance.

Timing lights are not that expensive. New engines are.

I agree. Your best bet is to go purchase a timing light. They usually sell for $35-$40 at Sears or Autozone...unless you get the fancy one with the dial on the back....they usually run about $70 but there's more you can do with them.

Is there a way to use the the ones with the dial (these are the one's with the knob right?) to check for total timing. My dad has a sunpro/actron gun that is a pretty old but very reliable, and it has the knob on the back. I was wondering what type of tuning tricks can be done with this type of gun. . . .

I use to always time by ear. In the 60's I'd advance the timing until the starter would kick back then bring the timing back a bit. This was with a 14:1 301 SBC and gas was 110 octane (@ $.25 a gallon!). I wouldn't advise that method now.

Originally posted by Slowpoke70:
Is there a way to use the the ones with the dial (these are the one's with the knob right?) to check for total timing. My dad has a sunpro/actron gun that is a pretty old but very reliable, and it has the knob on the back. I was wondering what type of tuning tricks can be done with this type of gun. . . . Yes there is. You can use it to figure out your timing curve or total timing when your damper doesn't have or doesn't have enough degree marks on it. The dial will delay the strobe for X number of degrees (X number is what you set with the dial), you would then read it by what it is showing on your degree marks plus the number of degrees you dialed out in the gun.
For total timing, just increase engine rpm's until the timing is no longer advancing.
to map out the curve you take readings at certain rpm intervals, holding the engine at certain rpms, ie, 2000, 2500, 3000, 3500, ect...

There may be other tricks that you can do with it.

A local engine builder told me that the dial back timing lights are not accurate and not to even bother using them. He said just use a damper with enough timing marks on it, or put timing tape on it and use a regular light, or a dial back one with the dial set at 0. I don't know if that is true or not. If I had a dial back light, i would try it out because my damper has 90 degrees of timing marks on it. It would be easy to prove or disprove the theory.

Originally posted by fourfiddyfour:
A local engine builder told me that the dial back timing lights are not accurate and not to even bother using them.Sounds like an opinion and not fact to me (and please no offense to you)
I have a dial back light and timing tape on my balancer..it's very close,close to +1/-1 degree from what I can see comparing the 2

We use to tune by ear by, advancing the distributor till the engine pinged under load, then back off on the timing until the pinging just stops. It was usually close. But that was in the day when we had to borrow timing lites and dwell tachs from the MECHANICS, that didn't trust their tools to kids!!!LOL!!!

Originally posted by mr 4 speed:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by fourfiddyfour:
A local engine builder told me that the dial back timing lights are not accurate and not to even bother using them.Sounds like an opinion and not fact to me (and please no offense to you)
I have a dial back light and timing tape on my balancer..it's very close,close to +1/-1 degree from what I can see comparing the 2 </font>[/QUOTE]cool graemlins/thumbsup.gif . thats just the comparison I was looking for. I only have a non-dial back light so I wasn't able to check this guys statement.

I used to do like Pat said to my junk 301 too!! Always worked OK for me.

My Base playing buddy in the band couldn't figure out how I could tune his '67, 210hp/327, Camaro that way until I asked him how he tuned his Base Guitar AND it was like a light turned on in his head!!

pdq67

Another option, which I use on my bracket car, is a Proform damper cover. It has markings so you can set total without a dial-back light. When my engine was on the stand, I check it for accuracy and it was right on the money.

I use a digital display Snap-On (dial back) timing light and it is dead on. However, it also cost me both arms and legs as well as my first born child when I paid for it!! :eek:

I've been told the dial backs don't work w/ a MSDS type ignition. Is this true? My new car will have MSDS and I was wondering if I needed to find a regular timing light rather than my dial back.

Originally posted by TWC:
I've been told the dial backs don't work w/ a MSDS type ignition. Is this true? My new car will have MSDS and I was wondering if I needed to find a regular timing light rather than my dial back. No not true... I have one of those "arm and a leg" digital snap-ons and it works fine with my
MSD distributor and 6AL.

A Craftsman dial back will not work with a multi-spark discharge ignition. Others might, but I know a Craftsman won't. I used a timing tape and two different Craftsman guns. The 30 year old Craftsman standard was right with the timing tape. The dialback was reading 8 degrees higher and very erraticaly.

My Craftsman dial-back works with MSD...

If you don't have total timing marks I have used this method with good results. Turn engine idle up to above 2500 rpm and advance timing to highest rpm , then back it down 200 rpm. That seems to work better than the by the ear method. If you have a after market cam and don't have total timing marks or dial timing light, a regular timing light is pretty worthless. Total timing is what you want.

P/Lineman, Did you get those links I sent you for the 12 bolt?

Originally posted by wayner:
We use to tune by ear by, advancing the distributor till the engine pinged under load, then back off on the timing until the pinging just stops. It was usually close. But that was in the day when we had to borrow timing lites and dwell tachs from the MECHANICS, that didn't trust their tools to kids!!!LOL!!! Problem with this theory is that it depends on what octane fuel you have, and what the octane requirements of the engine actually are. If you are running a higher octane fuel than you need, the engine might not ping until after you reached the optimal timing point. The end result is that you are losing power.

Mike

I have a msd 6al ignition and use a craftsmen dial back also use an old tube strobe that has to be ancient and have seen no difference in them.

Don't the new MSD setups only multispark after about 1500 rpm so that timing can be set more accurately? I talked to guy last week that told me that was how his new one was. I use a Mallory and don't have theses issues.

Before you even begin messing with timing check your TDC with a piston stop and invest in a timing tape it will save you hours of frustration.
I set my initial timing by vacuum with the engine warm and at idle NO mechanical advance I max out the vacuum then back off one inch if it has trouble starting back off more then recurve the mechanical for 36 degrees making sure it’s all in by 3000 rpm 3500 at the latest I found my heavier Chevelle runs better with a 2 stage mech advance.
The more cam you have the more initial timing you need to have any low end throttle response just remember to reset the mech limit to 36 degrees or in that area
It’s not uncommon to have 20 degrees initial with a bigger cam just remember it’s too much total at WOT that will kill a motor also they make starting retarders to set the timing back so you can start the thing if you need allot of initial, don’t be afraid of playing with your initial timing and curve just remember to make sure you reset your total without vacuum advance to 36 or so before running it WOT .
Another thing just my 2 cents but when I was first getting into muscle cars a racer at the track running a 9.25 et 427 coupe told me 90 percent of carburetor problems are fixed in the disturber I have found 25 years later that is still the best advice I was ever given.
I’m sure allot of you know this info just posting for those who might not.