Harold,

I'll be ordering some heads from Wolfplace soon and need a recommendation on a cam so I can get the right springs.

489 c.i.
454 bored .030 zero decked
4.25 Forged crank/rotating assembly 18cc dome
10.5 compression
Edelbrock dual plain air gap
Brodix race rites oval port 270cc, cnc'd chamber
Automatic w/ 10" 3000 stall
I'll probably have 3.55-3.73 gears
Carb, headers, ignition still to be decided.

This will all be going in a 73 Chevelle weighing over 4200 lbs. Mostly street driven, taken to the track 1-2 times a year.

I'm leaning towards a hydr. roller. Would like good street manners thats not too rough on the valve train and lets everyone know theres a cam in there ;) .

Not afraid to use a vaccum can. for power brakes if needed.

Looking for at least 550 hp/ low 12 sec. car and something I can cruise for 50 miles in hot weather and get the best power :rolleyes: .
Longevity and max power is that an oxymoron?

What should I run for a fuel pump also?

Hope I didnt miss anything, if you need more info let me know.

Thanks Mitch.

You can use the cam I have in my Biscayne, a heavy car like yours.

Single pattern UD/Lunati.
296 Adv. 233 @ .050 .625 lift. I have mine on a 109 sep.
Should give you what you`re wanting from a cam.

For ease and $$ put a Carter 172 GPH mechanical pump on it with a lightened bronze tipped pushrod and you`ll be set to go.

I can't argue with BigRed-L72.....

I also have a 232 @ .050, .600" valve lift, your choice of LSAs....
We have cores with the EverWear gear option, allowing you to use stock distributor gears instead of Bronze ones....

UDHarold

Is the 109 lsa good for the street or should be higher?

Harold Im a rookie here so a little more help on the proper lsa would be nice :D .

Whats the difference between the 109 and say a 112?

Any part numbers off hand.

Thanks, Mitch

That cam in my motor made 555hp/565ft-lbs and was good to about 5800 #s wise in my 460. That dyno was on the loose side though. But I have no doubt in the potential of this cam w/ the proper heads and tune, esp with big red's performance in a similar-weight car. 1st time to the track went 12.70 @ 113.x on p245 street radials, wt 4020lbs. This was on a 110 lobe sep with some inappropriate wide-by-huge rectangles for heads.
In a 496/489 I'd bet it would be on the docile side even at a 110. In my 454 it def. had a rumble and a unique exhaust note.

matt

Mitch,

Here is the thing about LSAs, and it is true for all cam companies. Wider LSAs, such as 112-114, have smoother idles, more vacuum, a better transition from idle into power, and a wider, flatter torque curve. Tighter LSAs, such as 106-108, make more mid-range torque and generally run better on the drag strip/oval track.

Engine size has a lot to do with how a LSA relates to an engine. A 454 BBC likes 110-112 LSAs, a 540 BBC thinks 110 is a little tight, and may like 112-114 better. When you get to 632s, Pro-Stock 500s, and anything 540 and bigger with a lot of NO2, you're now in the 116-118 LSA range. One of my customers runs 6.70s in a 632 with NO2 and a 118 LSA.
BTW, 396s-427s like 108-110 as normal, 112 as wide.
Each engine family has its own range of LSAs that it reacts to. The 440 Wedge seems to like anything, as long as it's on 108......

UDHarold

BigRed,
Is your car street or strip? How does it idle, vaccum OK?


So am I thinking right that the same cam in a 112ish lsa would make more power for my 489 than a 109.


Mitch

It`s a street car driven to and from the track.
It has a pretty thumpy sounding idle, very smooth though, no rocking and all that.
Vacuum wise, I have manual brakes and I can`t recall how much it was, sorry.

Matt,
When you say it would be docile in a 489 do you mean it could use a bigger cam? Do you think it would make more power than your 460 does/same power band?Did you have power brakes, how about vaccum?
I looked on Lunati's web site and couldnt find anything like you guys mentioned, do you have a part #?

Thanks guys, Mitch

I was just lookig on thier website and the 50269 looks close but its a dual pattern cam 234 244 @.050 .629 .612.

I guess I shouldnt rule out a street solid roller ,should I? How about the 502A1, A2 or A3??

Mitch

Mitch I don't **think** the old UDHR4 carries a lunati part number yet. You'd have to talk to harold about that. My power brakes worked fine.
Obviously I don't know much, but according to harolds post a bigger motor like yours would seem to be happier with something on a 112. In a 489 I wouldn't hesitate to go a bit bigger, but I thought you wanted a street motor. That cam should take with relative ease 4200lbs to low 12's with those nice heads your looking at. The HR4 had a pretty good rumble in my 460, streetable, but interesting exhaust note/rumble.
I recently had my 2nd hyd roller (non-harold grind) swapped out for a solid roller. Now its possible this solid roller is too big for my CR/motor/rpm range but I gained about 35hp. Not worth it over the proper hyd roller for a street/some strip motor, IMO. Before I decided to go solid roller, I was looking at some cam motion hyd rollers, in the 238-242 @ .050 range with a seat duration around that of the HR4.
I like hyd rollers although I know they aren't popular around here, and I am miles away from even a remotely serious racer. Ken jett's lunati hyd roller, the 50250 (I think, w/o looking anyway) took him pretty far in his canfield headed 460. If its the right grind, a hyd roller is great for the street w/ some strip, or even more strip, the 5.0 mustang crowd eats up hyd rollers around here.
I think the HR4 on a 112 would be fine for a 550+ hp mild 489. I wish I had a way to port the analog tape video of the HR4 in my car, but it seems like a pain.
If you want more wild, stretch the duration into the low 240's. I only suggest that since that is what cam motion rec'd for me before I went SR. (10.15:1 460, 4020ish+ lbs, TH400, 3.90s).
The HR4 on a 112 should be fine, but like I said I don't know all that much. My SR is on a 112, not very strip aggressive but I don't go to the strip very often. Power brakes require a little extra power from my leg, but they work, although the idle is pretty high.
I'd think a 489 w/ a mild hyd roller anywhere in the 230 to low 240 range would be ok in your situation. But with big red taking the HR4 so far in a 460, I'd imagine it would be easy to duplicate those #s in a 489. Either way you are well above 500hp and just need to figure out what way you want to go.. wish I could..
IF I were to switch cams again, I'd be looking at another hyd roller. My SR is fine and hasn't moved around at all, I just don't think its the best application for me.
All the strip times w/ the HR4 for me were on tiny street radials, 2.25 60's, but still pulling 113+mph w/ a lousy tune job.
Cam choice can is a pain, but a proven cam is always a plus. You should have a torque monster with the HR4 and those heads your looking at in a 489, should whip your car down the track @ 4200lbs in a hurry..

hth, matt

Thanks for the reply Matt. Yes cam selection is a pain, I was hoping Harold would give me a little better breakdown on a cam and part #.

Maybe it would be easier to just call.?

Harold if your still out there do you have a new revised HR4 cam or can you offer up a new part #?

Any one else with a suggestion???

Mitch

ttt

I'm on my lunch break at Excell School today, but I read your post.
The Lunati grind number for the HR296 in a BBC is 02-HR4-HR4-12-A01, if you want a 112 LSA, -10- if you want a 110 LSA. The part number is 50299 for any custom hydraulic or solid roller, and the EverWear gear option is available for a few bucks more. I recommend it because it allows you to use stock distributor gears. This cam makes enough power you need to make sure you have a good high-volume mech fuel pump and 1/2" fuel line from tank to carb.
Remember, wider(112-114) LSAs drive better at low speed and in traffic, tighter LSAs run better on the strip. I like 112 for the street with 4.25" cranks, 110 for 4.00" cranks, unless idle and vacuum are most important, the 112 is best......

UDHarold

FYI, I have a Crane Hyd roller in my 505.

Specs .244/.256 @.050
.632/632 lift
LSA 114

I used a split duration cam because my 074 heads are supposed to have poor exhaust flow. The longer exhaust duration is used alot on nitrous and blower cams to help the exhaust side keep up with the boosted intake side. I thought maybe the same principles of cam selection would work on my heads.

Anyway, my engine idles at 750rpm, has a nice lope and amazing throttle response for a long stroke engine. It pulls hard to 6500rpm, and 3800 to 6000 is unbelievable strong because it was already pulling so hard at lower rpm. It comes in hard. And I only have a 750DP on it for now.

For a daily driver I would go a step or two smaller, but the way it is now it is very mannered and streetable for the power it makes. I like my HR cam alot, just be sure your machinist understands the importance of having the right springs for the HR cam you chose. You cant fudge on the spring specs and have your engine rpm to its full potental.

Kamero,
Thanks for the info. btw what lifters are you using?

Mitch

Harold,
Thanks thats just what I wanted to hear.

If you think a custom grind would work better and you have any ideas go ahead and throw it at me Im all ears and would be willing to spend a few extra bucks if needed, if not I'll stick w/ what you gave me.

Thanks for your help, Mitch

I'm running the Crane lifters. The upper part of the Crane lifters, where the link bar attaches, goes only about 1/3 of the way around the diameter of the lifter. That makes it lighter than the lifters like the Comps that have a full circle "cup" on top. I also used the titanium spring retainers from the Doug Herbert catalog, I think they were only about $70.00 and weigh about half that of a steel retainer. If I remember right, the titanium weighed 18 grams and the steel was 34 grams.

Just curious how these cams perform day to day. I'm still thinking about going this route in my 489 with 781 heads and 10:1. Looking for a good one for 2500 stall and 3.50 gears. What kind of power could I expect?

Harold,
If your still out there what springs would you recommend for the HR4 cam you suggested.

Is there a good solid street roller also Harold? The reason I ask this is Im concerened about hyd. roller lifters coming apart.
Would a solid cam be better?

Mitch

Mitch,

We have been using the 73236, in about 1.930" installed height--This gives right at 130 lbs on the seat. This is a single spring with a dampener, the outer part of my favorite roller spring.
All American car manyfacturers have switched to hydraulic roller cams.

UDHarold

Harold, is that HR4 a steel billet cam or cast?
Thanks.

Lunati does NOT make cast roller cams---All roller cams are billet steel, some requiring bronze distributor gears, some, at extra cost, using stock distributor gears.
UDHarold

Thanks Harold. I was also wondering what that cam would perform like at a 241 duration, say in a 509?

SILVERSS454,

There will be a VooDoo 292 for the BBC, 292/300 at .006", 241/249 at .050", 164/170 at .200". .625"/.625" valve lift, and 110 LSA. The part number has not been assigned, but it is in the 'part-number assigning' stage. It will be available both as a MK IV and a MK VI cam..... There is also one designed for the SBF that gives .638" valve lift in the BBC..., other numbers the same.
There is also a 294@.006, 243 at .050, 166 at .200, .634" valve lift, from the SBC
VooDoo line.....

UDHarold