Hello guys,

Okay all of these things work. You guys will have to excuse me because I don't know the proper terms for all of these functions.


-left turn signal front/rear/ & they work when headlamp is engaged
-right tun signal front/rear/ & they work when the headlamp is engaged
-brake lights work/& they work when headlamp is engaged
-hazzards work
-dash lights work
-all marker lamps work

The one situation that doesn't work is the right tail light "running light".
By running light I mean when the the headlamp is engaged all the marker lights etc are on for night time use. The left tail lamp "running lights" works.

I have observed this...when headlamp/running light system is engaged and the turn signal is activated
-right turn signal works but both "in dash" indicators flash
-left turn signal works but "in dash" right indicator is actived and the left "in dash" indicator is flashing very faintly

Any ideas on this one??

Thanks

Kris

You have a ground problem causing the dash indicators to malfunction (probably to the back of the dash) and If I read you problem right ? one tail light is out ? but all other external lights are working ? Check the offending tail light bulb itself. The brake light filament may be good but the tail light filament could be burned out, If I'm reading it right ?
dave

I had a similar problem with my '71 Elky, and found the issue in the steering column signal switch at some brass contacts. The signals and brake lights all feed thru there.

Thanks guys,

The dash turn signals work properly when not the "head lamp on" stage. When they are in the head lamp on stage:

when headlamp/running light system is engaged and the turn signal is activated
-right turn signal works but both "in dash" indicators flash
-left turn signal works but "in dash" right indicator is actived and the left "in dash" indicator is flashing very faintly



The tail lamp bulbs all operate correctly when in the "head lamp off" stage. They are all brand new bulbs. It is only in the "running light" situation that the right rear tail lamp doesn't work.

Make sure that that taillight socket/bulb base has a good ground.

Hello Dean,
I had painted the inside of the tail light white but I have since sanded off the contact area to bare metal. This fixed the light brightness problem. I also attached test leads to the a known good ground.

I will try it again,

Kris

o.k. forget the dash for now, you have a ground problem to one or both tail lights, check, clean and tighten ground connections to body and as dean said the "inside of the bulb sockets" When your pulling the headlamps on, one tail light is trying to find the easiest way to ground, through the brake light circuit as they share the same ground. The reason for this is the extra load (current draw) with the headlights on.
hope that makes sense ?
dave

If you are cleaning the socket with any metal object I would disconnect the battery otherwise you may blow a fuse.

If you are cleaning the socket with any metal object I would disconnect the battery otherwise you may blow a fuse.
Not as long as it isn't done with the lights ON.
no power there with lights off.

I ran 'gator clip leads off the edges of the "grabber" hooks to a body ground (batt body ground wire) found of the sockets to a body ground and it didn't make any difference.

I did fiddle with the position of the sockets earlier so perhaps that is a problem. I will try to put the "grabber hooks" in better ground positions.

Okay very tired..
Kris

just because a bulb is brand new doesnt mean it works and just because one filiment works doesnt mean they both do, and, just because both filliments appear whole (and actually are) doesnt mean the connection from the filiment to the contact is sound, theres a ton of things could have gone wrong from manufacturing to shipping to our own mishandling, first things first, run a power lead to each contact on the bulb and ground to the outside metal housing, make sure they both work (its a dual filiment bulb as stated above, one for brakes and one for tail lights) or, just put that bulb in the socket thats working. then, with a test light, i would check the contacts in the bulb sockets, then poke in midway or so in the wire to said contact, or just on the back side of the contact, and keep working back till you find power .. since your other rear works, id have to put my money on one of those first two areas, probably the socket contact to the bulb contact....also make sure your inserting the "grabber hooks" as you call them, into the proper slot, one is shallow and one deep, and can be pretty easily forced into the wrong slot... good luck

just because a bulb is brand new doesnt mean it works and just because one filiment works doesnt mean they both do, and, just because both filliments appear whole (and actually are) doesnt mean the connection from the filiment to the contact is sound, theres a ton of things could have gone wrong from manufacturing to shipping to our own mishandling, first things first, run a power lead to each contact on the bulb and ground to the outside metal housing, make sure they both work (its a dual filiment bulb as stated above, one for brakes and one for tail lights) or, just put that bulb in the socket thats working. then, with a test light, i would check the contacts in the bulb sockets, then poke in midway or so in the wire to said contact, or just on the back side of the contact, and keep working back till you find power .. since your other rear works, id have to put my money on one of those first two areas, probably the socket contact to the bulb contact....also make sure your inserting the "grabber hooks" as you call them, into the proper slot, one is shallow and one deep, and can be pretty easily forced into the wrong slot... good luck

What about the dash indicator problem ?
dave

hmm, i think i missed post #4 earlier, dave may be right with the turn signal cam assembly/undercolumn harness thing, id put in in the state where its not working, start at the socket and try to work back from there, my guess is once he gets the rear blinkers and tails and stops working properly the dash will follow suit, theres no telling how a bad connection, ground or short will manifest itself, be it those noted by him above or any other bizarre combo of events (or, non-events), you might even want to try a new flasher, bottom line is: you just gotta keep plugging away, sooner or later you'll arrive at the source of the problem, or if its not a pristine original ss or something, run a wire from the good working side to the non-functional one, though, (and i guess i need a disclaimer here) this is not the correct, original, stock or even recommended by me, nor would i do it that way in a more perfect world, way to do it, its just another work around if all else fails and, it just might tell you if youre on the right track if, for example, the dashlight problems ceased....good luck

Can't think what a "grabber" is but here's the way I test to see if a bad ground is the problem.
I strip about 1 1/2 - 2 inches off one end of a scrap piece of light gauge stranded wire, wrap/twist it around the base of the bulb just below the glass and touch the other end to a known good ground.

You did check voltage AT the contacts down inside the taillight socket, right?

You say the front parking lights and front turn signals are both working/flashing properly and nice and brite?
I think I would double check the grounds to those sockets/bulbs also.

I assume when you say "running lights" you mean parking lights and taillights right?
Or are you calling side markers "running lights"?

I've always found that when the turn signal indicators in the dash are coming on when they shouldn't be coming on it's caused by a bad bulb, bad ground or bad connection at one of the taillight or parking light sockets (most of the time a bad ground) Don't think I've ever ran across one doing it that was caused by a problem in the turn signal switch.

OH, how does the wiring under the floor mat/back seat look?

Hello guys,

I started to mess around with the bulbs and I got the "running lights" to work. What I meaning by "running lights" is these are the lights that are likely to come on during a nightime scenerio. They are turned on when the headlamp system is engaged. I would like to try to research and find the proper names for each lighting system!!

I think I got it. As mentioned before there are 2 filaments in these bulbs which are meant for brake lights and the "running lights" and there are 2 "nipples" on the bottom of the bulb. If the bulb is in the wrong position one of these "nipples" doesn't touch the contact and therefore won't work. I think each nipple provides power to each filament.

You can even turn the bulb enough to get the brake light filament to work when the "running light" system is engaged. So proper placement of the nipples is important. Maybe that is why you seem some cars with one "running" light that is brighter than to other.

Now I do have a problem excess clearance in between the bulb and socket. It is to the point where I think the bulb would loosen up and stop working. Could I just put plastic pieces to "shim"the bulb tight??
I have a new socket installed but maybe it isn't a proper one.

Man, changing a light in a new car can be much more simpler and brighter!!

Thanks again,


Kris

Try some different bulbs, it's a bayonette type with staggared lugs on the bulb, it should only fit in one way ! but some cheap and nasty bulbs CAN be put it wrong ! but you shouldn't have to pack them out !
but if they're still loose ? you can put a small blob of solder on each nipple (bulb contact) and run some solder around the bulb base to make a tighter fit in the socket.

The first click of the lightswitch turns on the "tail lights" (rear) and "parking lights" (front). Second click pulls on the headlights. The indicator switch left and right flashes the "brake light" (rear) and "indicator" (front) on that side. The "hazzards" flash both brake lights and both indicators.

Every country and maybe even state ? could have a slightly different term for lighting.

Here we call the hood a "bonnet", the windsheild a "windscreen" and the trunk is a "boot" ! and we used to spell color "colour"
dave

when you pull the switch out one click and all lights except the headlamps and brake lights (filliments to be more exact) are powered is normally called "park or parking lights" why, i cant say for sure, my guess is, for safeties sake if you're parked off on the side of the road, but aren't actually in such peril as to warrant "emergency flashers" you should display these beacons...i think you may have misstyped that sentence dave, i'm pretty sure its the tail/park lights that flash a turn indication, not the stop lights...or maybe i misread it, and yes, those so called "nipples" are commonly known as "contacts"...although it is kind of fun to say, or even type "nipples".....nipples..nipples, nipples, opps, sorry, got caught up in the breast of the moment. er, best*

i think you may have misstyped that sentence dave, i'm pretty sure its the tail/park lights that flash a turn indication, not the stop lights
no, it's definately the brake lights (bright) that flash for turning ! check where your brake light switch (white) wire runs to ? But about the beacons and nipples ! you know what they say about breasts ? they're like toy train sets, designed for children but played with by men.
dave

i like big breasts, i don't care how they got that way. :)

i still have to disagree on the turn indicator though, if that were true, why do you see a blinker go on, then the brake lights light up constantly as the blinker still blinks, the brake lights go off as the corner is turned, then last, the blinker stops as the car straightens out?...and F.O.I. (for our information), i see that the front lights when "always on" are "park lights" and the rears are still tail lights and the lights on the side of the car (as dean pointed out so eloquently above) are termed "marker" lights...so i guess it just depends on where you're from as to weather collectively they are "running lights" or "parking lights" or just a waste of 12 perfectly good volts.

Thanks again guys,
I figured the "nipples" would get everyone charged up. I mean you can have "bulbs" with pepperoni nipples, and some "nipples" can be used as a coat hanger or to dial a phone with. It is always a bonus to handle big "bulbs".

Okay I will try to solder up to increase the tighness. It is loose on the sides maybe so Alum foil will do as well.

I remember a Australian lady calling a windshield a windscreen and I was trying to figure out what she was talking about. We all have our different takes on the English language..

So these are some the lighting systems as Dean pointed out tail lights (which I called running lights), marker lights, turn signal, brake, hazzard etc..

Just like in some parts they say "pop" while folks in other places call it "soda" (and sooo many other words like that)
To add to the confusion, we have people here from non-English speaking parts of the world.
And then we have a couple of people here that want to let the world know if someone spelled a word incorrectly just in case everyone else didn't catch it even though they know what was meant so we have to try to be very careful with what we type.

It doesn't really matter except that sometimes it makes it a little difficult to give an answer unless we know exactly which electrical device someone is talking about.

To me there is a difference between taillights, parking lights and running lights.
Running lights are usually thought of as marker lights such as all those lights on an 18-wheeler or the side markers on our Chevelles.

I didn't intend to change the topic of this thread to breasts, nipples or anything else by asking what I did.
We just need to be on the same page to be able to communicate with the same interchange thoughts.

It sounds like you really need a new socket to me.

i like big breasts, i don't care how they got that way. :)

i still have to disagree on the turn indicator though, .

yeah me too, oops where's my wife ?

It's the brake lights that flash ! try this, turn your lights off, turn your indicators on left or right ! put you foot on the brake ! what flashes ?

In Canada some confusion on "running lights" may arise because in some provinces it's the law to have parkers on all the time with ignition, new cars come that way there.
Dave

...........................

In Canada some confusion on "running lights" may arise because in some provinces it's the law to have parkers on all the time with ignition, new cars come that way there.
Dave
We call those "driving lights" here.

There is such a thing as TOO BIG :D

We call those "driving lights" here.

There is such a thing as TOO BIG :D

Only volvos have them here, running lights that is, I reckon a 44D is big enough ? why does it allways end up about breasts ?
Dave

That's true about the "running lights"in Canada. The 100% name is daytime running lights" which are actually part of the head lamp system. The are supposidly proven to reduce accidents by increasing visability.

These lights are on all day and night. I think all new cars sold in Canada after 1995 (??) have to have them. Maybe that is how "running lights" entered into my posts but now I see the light on the proper names.

I though that was a good idea but dosen't Alberta have the worst road toll per capita in the world ?
Dave

I don't recall anyone mentioning this but our Chevelles take 1157 brake lamp bulbs. Is that what you are using?

Wow, almost 30 replies...

Terms...

Parking lamps (the front indicators that illuminate when you pull the headlight knob out to the first position and then go out when pulled to the second position "headlights on" for 1964-1967. They illuminate in both positions for 1968-present.

Side marker lamps (located on the front and rear FENDERS of the vehicle. Connected into the same circuit for the parking lamps so they behave as described above for the 1968-present vehicles. Marker lamps did not exist prior to 1968 model year.

Turning lamps Some will argue that the above is incorrect and that there were marker lamps prior to '68. You're probably thinking of turning lamps--traditionally on higher end cars originally--Cadillac and Chrysler come to mind. When activating the turn signal lever, a steady glowing lamp on the front fender would illuminate steady to aid the driver in seeing the area in which they were about to turn the car. Also served as a warning to pedestrians.

Tail lamps Located in the rear of the vehicle. Are on a seperate circuit from the brake/turn signal circuit. Illuminate when the headlight position is pulled to the first or second position. Provide visual indication of your vehicle in the dark to vehicles behind you. No greater than 1/2 the brilliance of the brake/signal lamps.

TurnSignal lamps Flash at approx. 1 cycle per second when activated by the turnsignal switch. Depending on make or model of car, they may be the second (brighter) filament in tail light bulb, or a completely independent single filament bulb. The 1964-1972 Chevelles used a bulb which had 2 filaments, one provided the signal indication, the other, the tail indication. In the front of the car, you have the parking lamp indication (see 1st description) and turnsignal indication.

Brake lamps A steady glowing indicator that the driver has stepped on the brake pedal of the vehicle. The 1964-1972 Chevelles use the same filament for BRAKE and TURN in the rear lamps. The front turnsignal filament is within the same bulb as the front parking lamp (see the 1st description) but do NOT illuminate when the brake pedal is pressed.

1964-1972 Lamp operation for tail & turn & stop

When the headlight switch is pulled to the 1st or 2nd position, the tail lights illuminate steady. When the brake is applied, the second filament illuminates more brilliantly with a steady glow. When the turnsignal is activated, the appropriate tail lamp's BRAKE filament is interrupted and now flashes a approx. 1 cycle per second. Once the signal lever is in the cancel position, the brake circuit takes over, then any time the brake is applied, the steady glow will remain. Operation is completely the same with the tail lights off.



"Running lamps"--typically used to described indicators running along the extreme outline of vehicles' perimeters, used as a marker indicator for size and construction of the vehicle.

"Daytime Running Lamps" (DRLs). A circuit in modern vehicles that causes the high beam filaments in the headlights to illuminate at 1/2 normal brilliance anytime the headlights are not engaged and the vehicle is typically in moving gear.


"Lava Lamp" Introduced in approx. 1965 as a popular youth icon known for setting the mood or reflecting musical ambience or narcotic induced psychosis.


Coppertop lamp lessons 101.

Test will be on Monday. :)

Great description, there should be no more confusion, except, should we really call them lamps or lights ?
dave

Hello charbilly2001,

Yes I believe they are 1157's. I think Car Quest added another 1 to the beginning (CarQuest#)=11157 but they appear the same as the Phillips ones that I originally found.

Great description Coppertop.

Thanks

Kris

Hello charbilly2001,

Yes I believe they are 1157's. I think Car Quest added another 1 to the beginning (CarQuest#)=11157 but they appear the same as the Phillips ones that I originally found.

Great description Coppertop.

Thanks

Kris


Ok. Given that you have an 1157 in there then both of the electrical contacts in the bulb socket would be hot and the bulb has to have an external ground. If you turn on your headlights to the "parking light position and turn on the same side blinker then one of the socket contacts will be solid "hot" when tested with a test light and the other would be blinking. Does your faulty side running light socket operate like that? If it does then your electrical supply is good and something else is wrong.

What else could be wrong?

#1. The socket might not be grounded properly. Investigate and repair.

#2. The bulb could be bad. Investigate and replace. Just because it looks good does NOT mean it IS good. I have taken faulty brand new bulbs out of sealed packages.

If one electrical contact NEVER shows current when you test it with a test light then you may have an interrupted circuit.

The wiring harness to the rear of the car runs the length of the car under the drivers side carpet and thence under/behind both halves of the back seat, clipped up above the trunk lip of the left rear quarter panel to the left side tail light assembly and then across the rear of the trunk to the right rear tail light assembly. Under the carpet the harness is a flat ribbon harness which gets bunched up towards the rear of the car.


I have had to remove the seats and carpet from a car to find an open wire. Evidently someone somehow managed to sever a wire in the harness by dumping something into the car with a sharp edge. You just never know where you are going to find your solution.

I always start from where the electricity is NOT and then start going upstream until I find where the electricity IS.

check your nipples ! it's cold up there aint it ?

Hey guys,

Yes it is very cold up here today -35 degree Celcuis. I heard around this time of year it is summer in Australia?? I heard there is a big drag racing scene down there too.

Hello charbilly2001, I ended up getting the bulbs to work. Once I started change the bulbs position I got them to work I have tried them a few times since and everything seems to work. I have figured out a way to secure them in place. There was also a ground issue that I resolved with some sanding. It all seems to work fine right now but if something goes astray I will keep alll the tips in mind.

Thanks

Kris

Hey guys,

Yes it is very cold up here today -35 degree Celcuis. I heard around this time of year it is summer in Australia?? I heard there is a big drag racing scene down there too.


Kris

yeah, "summertime........... and the livin is easy"

drags ? check out http://www.andra.com.au/ or http://www.dragster.com.au/
dave

on my 64 i had all kinds of problems with the tail lights. found that the power strip running under the back seat was pinched by the seat frame
if you have not checked there, i would to make sure it is not grounding.:thumbsup: