Hey all,

I've been spraying Martin Senour 15210 etching primer- and its nice stuff. Getting ready to lay on a primer to block sand- and I want to save myself some money, so I came up with this.

1.)Finish my bare metal areas with etch.

2.) Use a Polyester Primer to create a uniform surface for Blocking, and block sand it- INSTEAD of using a urethane primer for blocking. The POLY would for me be MS line #15205.

3.) After Blocking, etc. with the "Poly Primer", THEN put on a layer of urethane primer (MS/ TINT Prime), to serve as final primer coat and a sealer, and not scuff it until I'm ready to paint.

The reason I wonder about this is that I'd rather block sand a $60.00 primer (and I'm SURE a gallon of the POLY goes a long Way) instead of Block sanding a $200.00 primer and running out and having to buy more, since I'm not a professional.

I just dont have that kind of money. I would guess that it would also benefit me in getting as straight a panel as possible. Is this feasible, and could I get away with spraying a couple of quarts rather than a gallon of the Urethane primer with the addition of teh POLY primer to my "system"?

My curiosity was piqued by another post by Gordon VM , and it sounded like a good idea, as well as possibly less expensive than block sanding a urethane, especially for a NON pro.

http://www.chevelles.com/forum/smile.gif

Rather than repeat the whole shebang, do a search for MARTINSR's paint basics on here about three weeks ago. It may convince you that polyester primer isn't the way to go unless you have some awfully wavy panels. Make sure you check the difference between urethane and epoxy primer. There's a heck of a difference in price also. Urethane doesn't cost $200. a gallon.

Although it isn't recommended to mix brands/system components, there are very reasonably priced "independent" brands of primers(and clears) on the market.

Vettefella,

I have all of MartinSr's stuff on file http://www.chevelles.com/forum/biggrin.gif. Anyway, I ran my initial "plan" by him on a couple of boards, including this one.

As far as epoxy primer goes, I have already started laying down a NAPA etching primer, and I have heard that epoxy doesn't block sand too well, so I am not really sure what purpose it would serve for me. My panels aren't super wavy, but I want them straight as possible, and want to block sand, so instead of burning through the expensive urethane primer surfacer, I thought it might be better to use the polyester primer for that purpose. The thing is I just dont want to be burning up all the expensive urethane p/surfacer for the sake of blocking, when I could block the polyester primer, and THEN put on coat of the urethane primer.

I was a little shocked too when I was told that the Martin Senour Tint/Primer 5103 was $200- COMPLETE (THAT DOES INCLUDE CATALYST, ETC!). That's why I thought that blocking the POLY might be best for the wallet! http://www.chevelles.com/forum/smile.gif

[This message has been edited by JU87 (edited 04-20-2002).]

JU87,I encourage you to get your panels as straight as you possibly can with fillers before any primer. The main benefits of using spray poly are 1:you can get panels very straight easier and 2; You are using a product that does not shrink as much as primers.(By the way, spray poly is not a primer, it's basically spray filler). The product that I use (Spies/Hecker) generally costs about $40.00 per panel to use. I don't use it to save money so I haven't compared it to the cost of applying many extra coats of primer to get similar results. I hope this answers some of your questions.
Gordon VM
Restotation Motorsports

First off, IF you did decide to use the polyester primer, you don't need to use any urethane as a "sealer", just shoot the color over the polyester.
An altertitive to the Tint/PRIME would be Econobody urethane primer, part # 15221 at about $45.00 a gallon.
As Vettfella said, your better choice may be to go to the 15221 and not use the polyester at all.
How much filling/surfacing do you have to do?

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1965 Buick Gran Sport Convertible
1965 Buick Skylark H/T
"Fan of most anything that moves human beings"

MartinSr,

I dont have all that much filling left to do.. I've already done metal work and filler work, and I'm pretty confident in my work, yet I still want the panels as straight as possible. I've done enough sanding of filler to believe I have the panels straight enough to prime and block. http://www.chevelles.com/forum/smile.gif

[This message has been edited by JU87 (edited 04-21-2002).]

You can block out the body to perfection with the urethane only. You could go the EconoBody 15221 or move up to 5101 Tec/PRIME which is a gray version of the Tint/PRIME at a lot less money (about $100.00 a gallon) Or one of my favorites 5102 at about the same.

Buy the way, it sounds as if your NAPA store is charging you full on re-tail for you products. Though this is very common in some areas (even OVER re-tail is common) go in and ask them if they could help you out and sell to you at a lower price. If they really wanted to, they could and not loose any money to speak of (that is a whole nother story).

You will never know unless you ask. Just tell them you would like to use the higher priced products all they through if you could. Is there anyway you could get a discount?

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1965 Buick Gran Sport Convertible
1965 Buick Skylark H/T
"Fan of most anything that moves human beings"

JU87, the spray filler is a great product but I think that you are using it for the wrong reasons. Its mainly used to get super wavy panels or very long panels that applying filler too would be hard before it sets up. Like Martin just said you can and will get a car straight as an Amish Elder by just using urethane primer.

I use Sherwin Williams products at work, really like their products but not happy with their clears, but anyway. We use a primer under the number of PH59, and the last time I went to paint store to pick up a gallon it was around 80 bucks. Now just keep in mind that sherwin williams and martin senour paint is the same stuff just under different labels and part numbers. We've had great results using the PH59 primer, try giving that number to your paint guy and seeing if it cross references to a MS paint number. It might even turn out that the PH59 is the same thing as this tint/prime line, I dont know, just throwing out some more suggestions...Eric

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1970 chevelle
1970 chevelle SS455 not a typo its a buick baby
1949 and 1972 chevy trucks
http://briefcase.yahoo.com/bc/sevt_chevelles

"Buy the way, it sounds as if your NAPA store is charging you full on re-tail for you products."

Yea, MartinSr, I think so too. The thing is that its the only NAPA in town that sells or so they say, can even ORDER paint. They told me the Tint prime was $100 dollars a gallon, and the chemicals to make it "a complete mixed gallon" were another $90 dollars= $197 (Tax http://www.chevelles.com/forum/frown.gif). WHen I first went in there, I tried to nicely tell the paint guy that I wanted to block, therefore needed a surfacer, and we went round and round because he was telling me I would be OK block sanding the......sealer (what on earth is the point?!), and the "discussion" went downhill from there!

I think maybe I ticked him off, as hes the "paint guru" of NAPA, or so I've been told http://www.chevelles.com/forum/rolleyes.gif . SO, he checked on the TINT/PRime and gave me a price of $197.00 gallon. AND he said that buying 2 qts. cost will cost me the same as buying 1 gallon of it- which I would venture to guess is BS. I'll talk to the guy, but I dont know if he will give me any sort of a discount. The products are great (I really like that 15210 etch), BUT SOME of the people behind the counter, WELL.....

sevt_chevelle,

I havent sprayed anything but etch yet. As for SW, You know, I guess it could be an alternative...BUT the equivalent etching primer from their dealer is $38 dollars a QUART!! At NAPA, its $13 a Quart!. I just have a limited budget to work with, and want to get the best results/products for the money I have. Good suggestion though- I'll get a price on that PH59 tomorrow, as well as the primers that MartinSr suggested (if the NAPA guy will give me a fair price?!). I know that this sort of undertaking is not cheap, but I just want the best bang for the buck. http://www.chevelles.com/forum/biggrin.gif