I am looking at a 71 454 SS clone that is in pretty good shape but I need to know what the typical bugs are. I know the weather strip on the trunk on my 67 was bad and caused rust in the trunk bottom but what are the little quirks like that on a 71? Where should I be looking for hidden rust and rot? Is there a weak link in the suspension I should know about? Sorry for all the questions but I dont know much about the 70-72s. The paint looks good and the interior is OK but the guy is asking $15,500 which seems alittle steep.

Ah, so you did start a thread over here.
-Cuisinartvette:waving:

A lot of people, not saying you in particular, don't really understand what kind of problems a $15,000 fourty year old car has, people look at it like its a three year old normal car or truck, if you know what I'm trying to say here.

There are $15000 cars and $30000 cars, visually sometimes to the average person, they don't understand the difference.

Say you narrow your search down to three cars, all around that price, okay lets say you get a professional body shop owner or one that does a lot of bodywork and maybe a little mechanical.

Tell him you will give him $200 to spend about an hour or two after work to look at these cars.

Get him and four jack stands, flashlight and a decent floor jack.

So you look at all three, you're out $600. And you don't have a car, but if you buy the one that he says is the best of the three, you might have saved yourself a ton of money down the road.

Anybody that has a car over $10000 should be willing to let somebody give it a good going over, if they won't then I would walk away.

Another point, when the body guy inspects it you can take notes and call them back, and that might help you in negotiations on price due to any repairs it needs.

I looked at a car a few years back, and I thought I knew what to look for, I have worked on cars off and on all my life, but the one I looked at 3/4'' thick bondo on the corner of the trunk pan, right out in the open, I didn't see it, I know it was that thick because he measured it.

Until you actually do a body off restoration or you are a body man by trade, you might as well have your grandmother look it over.

We should call these cars antiques instead of muscle cars, because of the age, they have specific problem areas that was never ever related to the original intent of the car.

An average person would probably do quite a bit of research before they spent $15000 on an antique, but, usually you can see almost all of the structure of a regular antique of whatever.

A fourty year old car usually has fourty year old wiring in them, wiring you can't see buried under the carpets, is there rust there, what was replaced before, old wiring in a car is like the old knot and tube they have in some of the older houses, if you don't move it around, it will last forever, remember a car is moving and sometimes that wiring gets frayed, theres a lot of old car fires.

So wheres the rust holes if any, what panels were replaced, a body man can tell by the original spotwelds as a rule, although those can be duplicated, because I have did that myself.

Now lets take a look at the mechanical end of it.

You can listen to it, and drive it, maybe take it someplace and pull a wheel off or a compression check, but doubtfull if any of that will happen, so its a drive and a listen.

Even if it needed a lot of mechanical work, as a rule that would probably cost you quite a bit less then doing major body work.

You probably quit reading this a while back, but, anyway maybe you are or maybe somebody else is still reading, I'll continue.

If I can get one person on here to listen to me its more then I get at home, because my wife sure won't.

Plan two.

Jackstands, flashlight, floorjack, digital camera, and old clothes, add that to the first list the camera and old clothes.

You're going to have to get pictures yourself, you'll get dirt in your hair if you have any, and in your eyes, and this takes some effort to get the right pictures.

Add a magnifying glass and pencil and paper to both lists.

Take your pictures probably about 18'' away plus pictures of both sides of the car from about a distance of three feet from the front and back about a foot off to the side, this will show any body lines or waviness in the panels.

You want pictures as clear as you can of the following.

The very bottom of both rocker panels, the sharp edge, your looking for any bulges or wheres its spreading apart.

A couple pictures of the floor supports under the car, there about 4'' wide and they go from one rocker panel over to the other probably three or four of those, there spotwelded to the floor of the car.

Open the doors and get a picture of the bottom of the door, might have to get a foot away and get it at an angle, not the outside, the very bottom.

If you're setting in the car, and you went outside you would be taking a picture of the bottom of your feet, and then move the camera over a little and get one of that front part of the rocker panel next to your feet.

Open the trunk and get one on each side where the trunk floor touches the inner wheel well and where the body and wheel well come together, than go to the side of the car, stick your head in the trunk just a little, and get one of the back part inside the trunk where the trunk latches.

Back under the car again, get one of each side of the bottom of the car directly behind the back bumper, if you do it right, the bumper will be in half of the picture. You will be looking straight up when you take these pictures.

Now, you'll see the gas tank, and there will be two supports that run from the front of the tank to the back of the tank, 3 or 4'' wide, get a picture of where the front and back of these supports end.

Beside of the gas tank is your frame, get a picture, a little hard to see, but you want the picture to show you where the body of the car actually bolts to the frame, there is a flattened out probably cracked rubber donut between the frame and the body, you don'y have to actually get a picture of the donut, but you're looking for structural rust.

While the trunk is open, get one of the bottom lip of the trunk, if you took your fingers and felt the very inside of the trunk lid thats what you want the picture of.

Back under the car again, where the back tire is, you want a picture of the part of the car that is directly behind the side of the tire, looking from underneath, directly above the axle, there is some metal that is like sandwiched together, its the inner wheel well, you want to see if that spotwelded metal is rusted or starting to spread apart a little.

Take a couple of pictures of the underside of the body where it starts to curve up from the floor pan and starts to go over the axle.

Now, maybe if they aren't looking or there pretty proud of this little gem, they will let you just pull back the corner of the carpet and get a picture of the front and back inside where your feet are, or better between your feet and the outside inside of the car. Did you like that explanation.:)

Then you can get pictures under the hood, inside the car, dash and headliner, and gauges, then maybe the bumpers .

Get a clear picture of any vin or tags, clear enough so you can read the numbers, if its big bucks matching numbers, then you have to get the engine transmission etc. numbers.

It will probably take a good full day to do this yourself, get everything ready and pictures and all, and a lot of people are not ambitious enough to do it, its work, and you have to be thorough, but if it takes you ten hours including travel time, you might have made $2000 an hour while you were working.

Yes, I'm not kidding, these antique bodies take a lot of money to fix.

If this helps just one person, then it was worth my two hours of two fingered typing.

I'm not going to proof read it, its to long, so you can take it for whats its worth, have a good one, and good luck.

Rob

I forgot one of the most important things, rough guess here, maybe 600 to 1000 people on this forum every day, probably a small percentage will actually look at the pictures you take, if you decide to do it and put them on here.

But if you stop and think about just the body shop experts alone that will see this, and amatuers can come up with some good suggestions also, I would think it would be pretty hard to get beat up to bad.

Anyway, you would have the satisfaction that you gave it your best shot.

Rob

Wow, Thanks Rob for all the info, I did read it all. I started looking at some gennie 71 SS454s and they can be had for just about hte same price as the car in question. I just dont think I will persue it. I am still looking though and will take your advice to heart. I will bring the digital cam the next time I go shopping.

Sounds like we married the same kind of woman.:clonk:

Don

Ah, so you did start a thread over here.
-Cuisinartvette:waving:


Hey man! :waving:

Yep, I have been looking at this site for some time but there arent usually many cars in SC for some reason. I Want to get a Chevelle with similar features as my vette AC, 454, PDB, etc. But I am a patient shopper and I dont to toss $17k at the first shiny paint job.

Meatball, you sound like you understood the intent I put out, trying to focus on the body, whereas a car a few years old, a person would focus more on the mileage and mechanical, even though most are bought for there looks alone.

Anyway, good luck on your venture.

Rob

You have alot of good information here. Clone or no clone, the body has to be at the top of the list. That is the one aspect that will leave your wallet crying. You can rewire a car, freshen up a motor, or even redo the whole undercarriage of one of these cars for a decent price. I defintely like the idea of having a professional body man look at it. Just let them no they are not held accountable but you just want an honest opinion. If the seller doesn't like this, walk away. It is either not what he says it is or the owner does not want to hear the truth. I took a major bath on my wifes 66 and it has been a hard lesson on labor hours and finances.

John Weaver

John, your comment, it can be a hard lesson on labor hours and finances, we see it all to often on these car forums, especially some of these that have came back from media blasting, and they looked like swiss cheese.

It must be an ego thing for men, deciding what to buy in a fourty year old car, and not playing it smart.

Meatball knows the deal, he's asking questions before he spends the money.

As for the ego trip, I am guilty of that also, thinking that I really knew what I was looking at, doing this frame off and all the information I have gotten off these car forums, I'm a little wiser, but still have a lot to learn, You made some good comments John.

To sum all of this up, anybody that is going to purchase a 40 year old car, unless you're a good body man, get some help from a body man.

Hows that go, if you're sick go to the doctor.

Rob