Can anyone explain to me how this works, if it does even work? Here's the link to where one is being sold on eBay: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Pontiac-Grand-Am-Gas-Saver-96-97-98-99-00-01-02-03-04_W0QQitemZ110042609758QQihZ001QQcategoryZ42604QQ rdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

bull$h!t If true it would come in every car. While the theory and equations support the idea, you cant just throw something like that in and expect it to work.

Wow! stack two of them, get 66% better mileage and 40 more HP! All kidding aside, you don't want to start believing this stuff. These type guys operate on the P.T. Barnum theory of business : "There's a sucker born every minute."

Oh...you do know that when product introductions happen on eBay that all scientific theory can be found in the vapors of the internet. I think that Al Gore invented the twister - didn't he?

If anyone is wondering where the Federal Trade Commission and the Consumer Protection Agency weighs in on such devices: well, they don't. In questionable consumer goods of no health threat the government is not really interested in the bit players, it has to be a larger scale fraud before their prosecution interest is peaked.

What has been well proven about the buyers of such items, is that besides a minor wallet twister, that their driving habits change. Even if they really don't mean to, most people interested in twisting the air going into their engine want the device to work, and they subtley change their driving habits without even giving it much of any thought.

Now ask yourself: why would you want to block the air path into your engine? Everyone seems to understand mandrel bent exhaust systems, or porting the intake manifold and cylinder heads etc., - but for some reason torturing the inlet airflow catches attention (undeservedly).

Thomas

Iam going to put them in my tail pipes too for a swirll effect. LOL.
Whats up Thomas

Just use a leaf blower for a supercharger. Works great.

For an EFI car these are worthless...

But I have to admit to considering something similiar under my carb to improve fuel atomization with my Air Gap intake. The theory I have been pondering is short turbulator blades along the idle discharge port side of the intake/carb barrel. Probably a silly idea :)

How about a turtle in your intake......Proven effective.

Check the web for government investigations into the claims of Nology and Splitfire. More investagations should be made by the claims of these turbo-crap things and Jacobs ignition products.

Nology claimed that by using their wires, you could increase the "energy" going to your plugs by 300 times, not 300%, 300 times. This claim is completely in opposition to the laws of thermodynamics. You can't get more out than you put in. That would be the equivalent of perpetual motion, a fools concept.

I would like to make one thing clear for those that may not know better. A spark plug that sparks is as good as it gets. It is true that when you use a lot of nitrous, turbo/super charge, or burn huge amounts of nitro, that you need a high amperage/high voltage spark to have the power to overcome the resistance of the plug gap. However, if you double the power that is required, the engine isn't going to run any better.

Only three things are required to have a running engine; an ignitable fuel mixture; compression, to provide the heat to evaporate the air/fuel mixture; and a properly timed spark.

If you increase the spark to 1000 times of what is required, you gain nothing. The most important thing concerning ignitions, IMHO, is cleanliness of cap and rotor. This means cleaning caps and rotors with some kind of grease removing cleaner after handling them. Finger prints contain salt, which attracts water, which conducts electric in high voltage conditions. If you are having trouble with missing and cross fire, the cap and rotor should be suspect. When in doubt, replace them, and clean them well after touching. I suggest going to Walgreens and buying a box of rubber gloves just for working on ignitions. To me, it's that important.

The spiral wound wires are not as suseptable to inductive crossfire as were the old solid wire cables. When I was 15, I put a set of cheap wires on a small block and taped them all in nice bundles on each side of the engine. When we tried to start the engine, it only sputtered and popped. Finally, after much cranking, enough gas got into the crankcase, that somehow it was ignited by the ill timed sparks and blew off the oil pan and one valve cover. My neighbor pointed out to me that I was stupid, and not only did I need to separate the wires, but I need higher quality wires like Packard 440 or TVRS.

That experience led to a lot of reading about ignitions and I think it helped my learning curve. My neighbor, Bob Moreland, was the best Sun testing equipment salesman in the US, and a retired Army radar instructor and Ham radio operator. He was a pretty smart fellow and gave me a lot of information that I have never found flawed. He explained that 90% of engine trouble was ignition related, 10% mechanical. Mechanics is pretty simple, electric is like voodoo. You can't see or smell, or hear it. (Bob also let me scrounge through the Sun junkyard and gave me the parts to build the old Sun dist machine that I still have in my garage. I use an old dist cap with windows in it and hook it to a working ignition system so I can check, with a timing light, to see if the rotor lines up with the contacts in the cap at the time the spark occurs. Sometimes, that is all that is needed to make an engine run MUCH better. Cross fire under cruise conditions is common with some of the old vacuum advance Delcos on high compression engines.)

By the way, one of the interesting things about spark coils is that, once the pionts open, the voltage will continue to rise in the coil until it finds a means of escape. That means it will find its way to ground somehow. It may be through the plug, the fouling on the plug, the plug wire insulation, jumping a gap inside the coil. Anywhere. The current must be dissapated in some way. That is why you should never test the coil by making it jump too large of a gap. The voltage will rise until it finds a gap to jump. If the gap outside of the coil is large enough, it will find a path to follow inside the coil, and then the coil will be junk. This applies to all ignition coils, no matter how they are constructed. The oil filled coils are 'somewhat' self healing, but that is not something you can depend upon. I have found that you could get a spark 2 1/4" long out of a Delco coil before it finds a path to follow inside the coil. If I had known how good that coil was, I would have put it on my car.

well to answer your question it works on the same principals as the test where you fill a 2 liter bottle with water and turn it upside down. if u just flip it it emptys slow but if you spin it the water twirls and lets air into the bottle letting the water out faster. that being said i doubt it works and i have never owned one but my local parts store had a couple really nice car guys running it and one of them had a pretty nice truck that he claimed to have installed it in with success so i dunno. id just put on a turbo....

The theory behind the Turtle is aiming the puddling of gas at the bottom of the manifold in the right direction for more even fuel distribution. Every manifold would require a different turtle. A different firing order would require a different turtle. Manifold porting would require a different turtle. If these designs are tested under repeatable conditions, they are probably a good ideas. Also, circle cars and drag cars would require different turtle designs since different forces are being applied to the puddled gas. Hence, the turtle designed for the dyno would not be the best design for the kind of racing you would be doing.

This leads back to what I keep stressing on this forum. You need to learn how to read plugs, and treat EACH cylinder as an independant engine. Only then can you make YOUR combo work with YOUR type of usage. Read my sig. Each particular throttle setting has it's own requirements. The pitch of the throttle plates on a carb varies the fuel distribution. That is why FI systems are so much better. With FI, what works on the dyno, pretty much works the same on the car. Carbs are, and have always been, a crap shoot. Generally speaking, an FI system can be run about 10% leaner than a carb simply because of better fuel distribution. With a carb, you have to jet for the leanest cylinder. O2 sensors on an 8 cyl. carburated car are still only giving you an average of what your engine is using, not information on each cylinder. Better, but not best.

Some years ago, I worked with a guy that had a 390 Ford and he asked me to go to the drags with him. With simple jet and timing changes, I dropped his time by 1 1/2 half seconds. (15 flat, to a 13.5) Same tires, same weight. This is the kind of difference good plug reading can make. Very often, jet staggering is needed. YOUR ENGINE WILL TELL YOU WHAT IT WANTS. IT TELLS YOU BY PUTTING THE INFORMATION ON THE SPARK PLUGS. ALL YOU NEED TO DO IS LOOK! The point I'm trying to make here is, it's not me that is a great tuner. I just look at what the engine is asking for. It is that simple. Even when you are at the track, and you go up two jet sizes and pick up MPH, you still don't know if that is the best you can do without reading plugs to see if you need to stagger. You go up one jet size and run slower. You still don't know if putting a larger jet in one hole and a smaller in another will make you run better. The plugs will tell you what move you need to make.

Lets look at the obvious real quick and you see why it doesnt work right. It looks like a good theory when you think about it in terms of the pop bottle.....the only difference is that its the exact opposite. When you spin the pop bottle....you are the input. You provide the energy that makes the fluid swirl and exit easier(you are the motor).

But with this twister, the twister isnt a motor. It doesnt "spin" the air.....the air causes the twister to "spin"(that would be like having the fluid spin itself). This twister thing is just in the way of the normal motion of things. Because of the way the blades are cut....as the air rams into it, the air spins the twister. So basically, you are just wasting the energy in the air to constantly push this thing out of the way(not to mention restrict airflow). And yeah...in this case rigging up a leafblower probably would work better.

This is America, we sell a magic elixir for everything.
Truth in advertising/sales hasn't disappeared, it never existed.

Joe

>> "Truth in advertising/sales hasn't disappeared, it never existed."

perzackly.

anybody wanna buy a super-killer triple trick double throw-down 60,000 volt coil? I promise it will double your gas milage and cut your emissions in half while increasing your HP by 50%. It works by combusting all the left over hydrocarbons in the gas. The US Government calls these "unburned Hydrocarbons" and they are a major source of pollution in all the big cities. You can help the pollution problem while gaining 50% HP and doubling your gas mileage. It's cheap too. Only $600 cash and get this, today only I will give you a $500 rebate via my reputable personal bank account in Lagos, Nigeria.
This will be all over the net in a couple days and I will probably run out of stock since the special oxygen-free superconducting copper-ceramic wire used is in short supply so BUY NOW.


PS Did I mention that it will cut your emissions in half while while doubling your gas mileage and increase your HP by 50%?

PPS recent scientific research proves this device cures Erectile Dysfunction while stopping Male Pattern Baldness and growing new hair in the bald spots.

PPS and for all you dinkydicks out there this same scientifically proven device will cause the size of your Member to double practically overnight?







See, I thought that up in the time it took to type it. I'm going to paint an old Accel super-coil red and post the whole thing up on ebay. I'll be filthy rich in a few hours.






j/k, you realize, right?

>> "Truth in advertising/sales hasn't disappeared, it never existed."

perzackly.

anybody wanna buy a super-killer triple trick double throw-down 60,000 volt coil? I promise it will double your gas milage and cut your emissions in half while increasing your HP by 50%. It works by combusting all the left over hydrocarbons in the gas. The US Government calls these "unburned Hydrocarbons" and they are a major source of pollution in all the big cities. You can help the pollution problem while gaining 50% HP and doubling your gas mileage. It's cheap too. Only $600 cash and get this, today only I will give you a $500 rebate via my reputable personal bank account in Lagos, Nigeria.
This will be all over the net in a couple days and I will probably run out of stock since the special oxygen-free superconducting copper-ceramic wire used is in short supply so BUY NOW.


PS Did I mention that it will cut your emissions in half while while doubling your gas mileage and increase your HP by 50%?

PPS recent scientific research proves this device cures Erectile Dysfunction while stopping Male Pattern Baldness and growing new hair in the bald spots.

PPS and for all you dinkydicks out there this same scientifically proven device will cause the size of your Member to double practically overnight?







See, I thought that up in the time it took to type it. I'm going to paint an old Accel super-coil red and post the whole thing up on ebay. I'll be filthy rich in a few hours.






j/k, you realize, right?
=
If I pay in advance can I get a special price :D :D

I need about four of those red coily looking things. Quick! Do they also stop night time emissions? If so, send six!

"Only three things are required to have a running engine; an ignitable fuel mixture; compression, to provide the heat to evaporate the air/fuel mixture; and a properly timed spark."...not exactly true, some engines run pretty good on just two of those three
if you have an air gap intake, youd be better off stuffing a bag of ice in it before a run ...i agree totally with kirkwoodken on the plug reading, if you do a search there was recently a thread with a bunch of great plug reading links

HRD: you belong on the diesel forum. Kirk

whats a "diesel"?

Diesel is another word for a German inventor. Also known as an auf poopf roar mit outen der blitzen spritzers! Yaaahhhhhhh!!!

I've heard the same said about MSD ignitions in street cars yet everyone thinks a red box under the hood means power.

Reminds me of when Shell sold gasoline that was suppose to have "Platformate" in it to make your car go for longer distances than other gasolines. When investigated it was found to be a lie by the Shell Oil Company. How many of you guys are old enough to remember that?

I do. Been a long time since I've heard about Platformate.

You dont have to give me a "special price" like "some guys" want.....Ill pay extra!!! Heck, you dont even have to really send me one. Ill still buy if you just tell people I own it.....then Ill be the talk of the town. Hehe, just kiddin guys. Dont send the wolves after me!

Ah yes, der blitzen spritzers . . . they work every time.

LMAO at Tom . . .

Best thread I've read here in a while :D

what does a red box under the hood mean then?

Could be buried treasure in a depressed area.

It works by creating a vortex with similar increase in air pressure to a centrifugal supercharger, like Vortex. Adding STP oil treatment will help increase the speed of the votex and it also works best when installing a stronger power band. I find that the green power bands work a bit better than the red ones when using high vortex boost set ups.

Quote:"It works by creating a vortex with similar increase in air pressure to a centrifugal supercharger, like Vortex. Adding STP oil treatment will help increase the speed of the votex and it also works best when installing a stronger power band. I find that the green power bands work a bit better than the red ones when using high vortex boost set ups."


I have observed that electric motors that use blue amps always run cooler than those that use red and green amps. Also, never use a blue amp fuse in a green amp circuit: won't pass the smoke test!!

http://kalecoauto.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1&products_id=30

You can even get an adjustable power band now.

That is the greatest website EVER. Ive looked at it before too, and Ive always wondered how they keep runningm cause its obviously all gag stuff! Just to note some of the hilarious stuff they have advertised on there before, I remember once they had advertised an engine oil bypass kit in which you installed this product and it caused the oil to bypass the engine. Reason being.....oil gets dirty so you dont want it running through your engine and mucking it up. Put in the bypass and the engine or its oil never gets dirty. Another great one was the rad they have. Heat energy is power......wasted heat is wasted power so they had advertised a kit or something to block off your rad in hopes to NOT let the heat escape(youd trap more heat energy!!!). Another great one was the cam lock plate! With the cam spinning away like mad, it uses lots of energy and creates friction. When you lock the cam in place and dont allow it to spin.....you save lots of wasted energy and waste less power. I dont know how much stuff they have advertised on there right now cause its been a while since I went all through the site, but its worth it cause its a great laugh!

Don't forget "Muffler-bearings"...............

pdq67