OK, I'm doing all the body work and painting of my 70 Chevelle and I'm convinced that I'm crazy or need a life or something! I went to a car show and House of Kolor had a booth and they convinced me that I can paint my car and achieve excellent results.

I did smooth the firewall and patch the hole the factory air was with decent results but I'm starting to get confused as to the exact procedures.

1) I'm stripping the factory paint down to bare metal

2) I'm replacing the rear quarters, then stripping the black paint on the fenders from NPD

3) New front fenders, wheel wells and complete front end, again stripping the paint down to metal

So here are my questions:

1) House of Kolors epoxy primer KP-2CF says to paint on prepped bare metal or factory primer only, what's considered prepped bare metal?

2) After stripping all paint, do I shot the primer THEN use body filler to fill the dents?

3) After using the body filler, do I shoot another coat of their epoxy primer over the top?

4) The local paint shop sold me some Mar-Hyde Quicksand 2K polyester primer, they told me to shoot 2-3 coats then block sand the entire car, reshooting over low spots until perfect, this I understand but do I spray this on bare metal or over the epoxy primer? Then do I spray another coat of epoxy primer over this? Or just their sealer?

I'm sorry for so many questions but I thought I had a handle on it until I started reading this forum, now I have doubts! I just need the order that the materials are supposed to be laid down.

Thanks,

Lee

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1970 ZZ502 Chevelle (http://www.1970chevelle.net)
1967 ZZ502 Camaro 12.04@115 (http://www.1967camaro.net)
1997 Yukon 4x4 13.7@98 (http://www.blown4x4.com)

I have used House of Kolor stuff.. Personally I think they are awesome. www.normieschevelle.com/bike (http://www.normieschevelle.com/bike) I did the galaxy grey and orion silver with the brandywine candy topcoat. remember a few things. if you use they're KO-SEAL too make an even color make sure you allow it too dry overnight then wetsand with 500 grit.. if you immediately topcoat you will get sags and seperation BADLY.. So let it dry a day minimum. As for your body work.. once at bare metal you should clean and prep the metal and do as much body work before shooting primer (at least that is the way I learned) also you get the best adhesion with a ROUGH (36 40 grit sanded) bare metal or epoxy primed surface. You can always spot prime.. but if you build the primer too much your asking for paint trouble in the future. Primer should be 1.5-2 mils thick before topcoat after sanding (2-3 coats of primer before sanding) then your basecoat, candy and clear. The painting process I used was as follows.

Sharpe Platinum HVLP Low Volume gun(7 CFM)
50 PSI flowing through the gun (trigger open)
5-6 inch Fan pattern from gun
6-8 inches away from surface
75% overlap
First mist coat the base color allow too tack up (5 minutes) then with medium to heavy coats I complete the "First pass of basecolor"

15-45 minutes I apply second coat (medium to heavy)

If I like the second coat coverage I stop there if I don't 15-45 minutes depending on paint setup and shop temp I apply Third coat

Then I intercoat clear the basecoat about 1 hour drytime in between the basecoat and the intercoat clear. Two light too medium coats 15-45 mins dry time in between.

I allow the base and clear too set up overnight, reducing the chances of sags and runs. Wet sand clear lightly with 500 grit and clean thoroughly.

Second day I do the Kandy topcoat. same settings and procedure, except use coats (2-5 coats) too get the color you want. Then allow 1 hour dry time, and final clear. Once the first two coats of clear are on, I lay on the remainder of the clear as thick as possible without getting runs or sags. (you will have the feel for it by the second coat) and allow too dry. The flowout of this paint is remarkable. Hardly any peel and the shine is incredible. and VERY easy too work with. as long as you have the idea of how too paint, and MIX and follow the tech sheets you will not be sorry!!!! you can find cheap HOK stuff and tech sheets here.. www.autobodysupply.net (http://www.autobodysupply.net) I bought all of my stuff from them and it is discounted and usually at the door in two weeks or less. Do a search on JimmyP and Martinsr too find more detailed info about body work.. Good Luck.. we want too see Pictures!!! Also remember with the Kandy Topcoat. measure exactly and remember how many coats and how heavy you sprayed so you can duplicate on seperate parts or touchups later in life..

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X-Ray View of my Chevelle http://www.chevelles.com/forum/biggrin.gif (http://www.normieschevelle.com/sideview.jpg)
Getting Closer (http://www.normieschevelle.com/passfull.jpg)

[This message has been edited by normie (edited 11-13-2001).]

normie - thanks for the input, I sure wish the body was perfect and all I had to do was paint it! I'm having a hard time waiting for the outcome. Here is a picture of the engine bay http://www.1970chevelle.net/ac_lines.JPG , it's real hard to see the true color but I'm telling you, it's incredible!

Lee

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1970 ZZ502 Chevelle (http://www.1970chevelle.net)
1967 ZZ502 Camaro 12.04@115 (http://www.1967camaro.net)
1997 Yukon 4x4 13.7@98 (http://www.blown4x4.com)

[This message has been edited by 70_chevelle (edited 11-13-2001).]

Looks like you already know how too paint HOK and were looking for an excuse too show us your engine bay http://www.chevelles.com/forum/biggrin.gif Very nice work.. and the color looks astounding! When I was putting the brandywine over the silver/grey I almost cried it changed the feel of the color sooo much.. HOK makes nice stuff..

Sounds like you have things under control. House of color is supposed to be one of the best.

Can't wait to see pics of the car done. http://www.chevelles.com/forum/biggrin.gif
L8R
Tim

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Mr. D

http://imagehost.auctionwatch.com/preview/du/dugo/usflag.gif

72 454 El Camino turbo400
68 Camaro RS/SS 350 M4
73 RS/LT/Z28 Camaro M4
99 Firebird TA WS-6 A4 Color: Pewter
1995 WWW LT-1 Caprice A4
An all GM site http://www.gmforums.com

[This message has been edited by Mr. D (edited 11-14-2001).]

normie - no bragging here, at least not until the car is done!

Any ways, I thought I had it under control with the steps supplied by the paint company but after reading the posts from this forum I have my doubts. Like I've never heard about the intercoat of clear, does this help the look or is it for a longer lasting paint job?

I dont want to sound like a broken record, but do I prime with their epoxy to bare metal then apply the bondo? Or apply bondo then spray the epoxy?

Also, does the polyester spray filler go on before the epoxy primer or after?

Sorry,

Lee

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1970 ZZ502 Chevelle (http://www.1970chevelle.net)
1967 ZZ502 Camaro 12.04@115 (http://www.1967camaro.net)
1997 Yukon 4x4 13.7@98 (http://www.blown4x4.com)

Mr. D - Nice to hear from another Utahn! From your sig it sounds like you have some nice cars, have you been out to RMR racing any of them? Just curious to see if we've crossed paths before.

Lee

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1970 ZZ502 Chevelle (http://www.1970chevelle.net)
1967 ZZ502 Camaro 12.04@115 (http://www.1967camaro.net)
1997 Yukon 4x4 13.7@98 (http://www.blown4x4.com)

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 70_chevelle:
normie - no bragging here, at least not until the car is done!

Any ways, I thought I had it under control with the steps supplied by the paint company but after reading the posts from this forum I have my doubts. Like I've never heard about the intercoat of clear, does this help the look or is it for a longer lasting paint job?

I dont want to sound like a broken record, but do I prime with their epoxy to bare metal then apply the bondo? Or apply bondo then spray the epoxy?

Also, does the polyester spray filler go on before the epoxy primer or after?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Intercoat clear is a "Buffer" between basecoat and Kandy.. just in case you mess up the Kandy you know you have two layers of clear between the candy and topcoat so you don't have too start over again, Or if you are doing artwork and don't want tape too lift or move metallics etc.. It's basically clear without hardener. Follow the tech sheets on the web site I linked earlier. They are the correct tech sheets. Or if you buy from the company they will send you a complete book of tech sheets.. (at least they did for me) As for your filler question. I've always heard it's better too do the bulk of your filling on bare metal, but you CAN do it over an epoxy primer that has been sanded rough (36/40 grit) and then apply.. filler needs something too BITE too. Spray filler will be your last bit of primer, not sure if you need too reprime that before topcoat, haven't used it yet.. I'm sure some of the guys here would know though. That IS a great color.. regardless if the car is finished or not.. and looks like you laid it on nicely! Good Luck



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X-Ray View of my Chevelle :D (http://www.normieschevelle.com/sideview.jpg)
Getting Closer (http://www.normieschevelle.com/passfull.jpg)

70_chevelle, you dont want to put expoy primer over bare metal. First spray on one coat of self etching primer or also named wash primer. The expoy doesnt have the properties to fight corrosion like the wash primer does. Wait 45 mins after you have sprayed on the wash primer then spray on your expoy primer. Let the expoy set up and fully cure day or two will do. Then lightly sand the areas that need filler with 80 grit to give the filler something to bite too.

Once you are done with the filler work and ready for primer, first apply one coat of your wash primer over any bare metal spots and very lighty spray onto the filler. This protects the metal. Once the wash primer has flashed off apply your 2K primer. Also any time you have sanded through to bare metal apply one coat of that wash primer over just those areas to protect it.

As for the spray filler why are you using that? The spray filler if we are talking about the same stuff is basically a liquid formof bondo. Why not just use a regular 2K urethane primer? If you do choose to spray that stuff on you need to finish it off with the 2K urethane primer. I would only apply one application of the spray filler, block it out and then shoot your 2k primer.

If I was you I would call up House of Kolor and ask some questions. Ask them how their products should be used, and certainly ask them about that spray filler, sounds like someone else but house of kolor sold you that stuff. I know peolpe that use that spray filler and like it but me personally dont like it and dont use it.

sevt_chevelle - Thanks for the input. The reason for the spray filler is because I saw them use it on dream car garage and they said that it's the only way to get a perfect body job with no ripples or waves. They said it also allows the doors and fenders to match perfectly once block sanded. Plus they used it on my wifes camaro and it has a unique and smooth look throughout the car. I know the camaro looks far better with it then without because there is no ripples, and trust me, the guy who painted it was far from being a pro so I figured it hid his problems. Does this make any sense?

Do you recommend a brand for the self etching primer?

BTW, I did talk to HOK, they were very knowledgable but I didn't get into the nitty gritty of body work, just their paint. I even bought 2 vidoe's from them and it doens't really help with the prep work, it just says to prep very well!

Thanks,

Lee

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1970 ZZ502 Chevelle (http://www.1970chevelle.net)
1967 ZZ502 Camaro 12.04@115 (http://www.1967camaro.net)
1997 Yukon 4x4 13.7@98 (http://www.blown4x4.com)

70_chevelle I have used PPG, Dupont and sherman williams etching primer. I know lots of people that just use the dupont etching primer and spray another brand of paint over that. Personal I dont like PPG primer, I use and like the stuff from sherman williams. I use sherman williams at work and at home. I just use the sherman williams etching primer then follow up with PPG expoy primer and then 2K primer.

I fully understand what you are saying about the spray filler and maybe we are thinking of two different things. The spray filler I am thinking about is like a watered down body filler. It has more mil buildup then regular 2K primer but not as much as regular bondo. I would only apply one or two applications of the spray filler then follow up with the the regular 2K primer.

I think HOK makes an etching primer. But I have intermixed PPG and HOK primer successfully after letting the first primer cure. I used PPG DTM primer as a base then used HOK 2k and then HOK sealer. no lifting, or compatibility issues. Just make sure too allow the primers too cure fully and too sand and clean well. I don't forsee any issues with any etch primer then HOK 2 part epoxy. just make sure it can bite http://www.chevelles.com/forum/smile.gif

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X-Ray View of my Chevelle :D (http://www.normieschevelle.com/sideview.jpg)
Getting Closer (http://www.normieschevelle.com/passfull.jpg)

Lee;

You talked about stripping the black paint off of the new fenders. Why would you want to do that???? Those new fenders are E-coated with a corrosion resistant cationic epoxy. This is done in a bath of paint. If you strip that coating off, I can guarantee that you won't be able to protect it better by priming it yourself. All you need to do to those new parts is rough-up the surface and spray on your primer/surfacer.

ehjorten - The only reason was they are from NP? and they fit like crap so I could only assume that the coating was crap too.

I tried to remove some with paint remover today and it barely smudged it! So I guess I'll leave it on.

Thanks,

Lee

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1970 ZZ502 Chevelle (http://www.1970chevelle.net)
1967 ZZ502 Camaro 12.04@115 (http://www.1967camaro.net)
1997 Yukon 4x4 13.7@98 (http://www.blown4x4.com)