I just put new Hotchkis springs in the rear and will be putting new ones in the front but so far my car is sitting lower on the driver side than the pass side. Is this a sign of a tweaked frame? should I space up the coil on the driver side to get it level? My car sat crooked before with the stock springs but I figured it was because the springs were shot. any thoughts on how to check everything out and get it level?

Thanks

I have the exact same problem and still have not figured it out...I thought it was because I installed everything (all Hotchkis) w/the body off the frame, but alas, after reinstall, same problem. I have since put the car on a rack, loosened all the control arm bolts and re-torqued them and still the driver's side rear sits a little lower than the pass. side...Still not sure where to go from here..I have seen a couple of other cars on the road w/the same thing and before I took the body off for frame work, I can't remember if it sat unlevel or not....My pics make it look like it was level before....If you hear anything else about ideas, PLEASE let me know.....I haven't had time lately, but my next step is to get the car back on the rack and measure distances of rack to frame, frame to body, etc. to see if it's suspension or maybe it's got something to do with the body mounts.......anyway, good luck....

Got the same problem with my 67. It sits lower about 5/8 of an inch on drivers side,I'm doing a frame off resto and its driving me nuts.I'm almost sure it's the frame,I measured from floor to frame from front to back and it sits about 5/8 of an inch higher on the passenger side.I'm going to take it to a frame shop this week and have it checked out . If the frame is bent how do they bend it back with the body on the car.I'm bracing myself for big bucks

Hey guys sign me up too! Are we going to start weekly support group meetings over this frame crap:D , just finished Centerforce Clutch release meetings and that took me a year to get over.:( One of these days, I'd like to go to the darn track!

Drivers side lean of 3/4-1" I did a frame off on the car(70 Velle), all body bushings are new. New springs all the way around that have been swapped from side to side. Did the fronts last night with NO change what so ever, new shocks, everything new. The only clue, I don't remember the body lean prior to changing over to stock front disc brakes and new Moog springs. Lean seems to be recent in my case, but it did have a lean prior to resto, but was gone until just recently. Again, I'm not sure when the lean came back???

Also searched the archives and found 8 out of 10 lean problems were on the drivers side. Also noticed that most went unresolved just like the dreaded CF DF release problems.

I'm off to the frame shop myself for other reasons, the alignment shop was unable to get positive caster. It's either frame sag or the front end to high or a combination of both.

The lean..........I don't know????

If the frame is bent how do they bend it back with the body on the car.I'm bracing myself for big bucks

I had my frame straightened while the body was off. The cost of straightening the frame and all the sandblasting and powdercoating that I had done (frame, radiator support, and trans crossmember) came to $851. I'm not sure how much of the $851 was the actual straightening portion, but it couldn't have been too much.


BTW, I know it's probably a stupid question, but you guys all checked for equal tire pressure (and tire size for that matter) left to right, correct?

Tire pressure was one of my first thoughts but they are equal and tire size is a good match. There was no frame damage that I noticed when I took the body off a few years ago. I hope to change the front springs soon and see how much that helps

There was no frame damage that I noticed when I took the body off a few years ago.

There doesn't have to be visible signs of damage for a frame to be tweaked.

I gave my car a pretty thorough inspection before I bought it. Even once the body was off the frame, you couldn't tell just by looking at it that it was tweaked. There weren't any real visible signs of 'trauma', but sure enough, it has about an inch higher in the right rear than on the left rear.

Before you go spending money on springs that may not fix your problem, try measuring diagonally across the frame. Find some good reference points (like radiator support mounts or sway bar mounts in the front, and maybe body-to-frame mounts in the rear) so you can get a measurement from left front to right rear corner, and from right front to left rear corner. Ideally, these would be the same, if they're not, your frame may be the culprit, not your springs. Springs cost $$$, measuring is free.

This thread (http://www.chevelles.com/forums/showthread.php?p=644982) may help you with the measurements.

Hey guys!

I just finished restoring my Dad's 1965 Olds 442. He's the original owner and drove it off the showroom floor in July 1965.

When restoring the car, I also noticed that it had a lean to one side, exactly as you're describing.

I asked my Dad about it and he told me that the car was built this way. He had the same problem when it was new, and had it at the dealer many times, and the dealer told him "they all do this"

He solved it with some alumnium spring spacers on that side. I did the same thing and fixed the lean. He attributes it to the variety of accessories; in the case of the Olds, the alternator, battery, PS pump, brake booster, and steering box (all heavy items) are mounted on the drivers side. That exaserbates the problem. If he had AC and AIR pump, that would have put more weight on the passenger side and balanced things out. He thinks the factory assumed ride height balance with all accessories (but that's just a theory)

Based on the number of issues I've seen posted on this in other forums (I also have a 66 Skylark with the same problem), I just think this is a natural issue with the car.

Not to say that it's not annoying, but I doubt it's an issue with the frame.

Just my $.02.

:p You guys need to go on a diet :p

I don't think I would use the spacer approach as there is a high probability they may fall out

Does it lean all the time or just under certain circumstances
Body bushings on the driver side have a tendancy to take more abuse than the ones on the pass side

Just my .02 worth

My 67 El Camino leans to the left about 1/2 lower. I have tried to install differance rear springs and such with no luck. I have just gotten used to it. It is not a "pretty car" anyway so, Oh Well! :clonk:

Also have drivers side, left front lean. The right rear is also up.

This is at least an inch. Have put a jack under the frame about where the driver sits and lifted a bit til it sits just perfect. Seems like more left front spring pressure would accomplish the same thing.

Have not done any measuring on frame, body or checking spring heights yet.

There has to be an explanation. The battery (darn heavy one) is on the passenger side and I am sure offsets the power steering and brake booster on the drivers side. Also the alternator is on the passenger side.

Maybe its just too many years of a heavy driver with no passengers and so the left front spring has lost some of its strength. New springs should resolve this.

I can't imagine the frame being the cause of this problem. The frames are not that rigid. Just put a jack somewhere under the car and start lifting and you will see lots of flex, so when it is sitting on four wheels and with spring support it should reach a neutral stance especially after having been driven around so everything is "settled".

Need to order some springs. Any recommendations on springs for 66 big block. Would like to get the front end up to where it is level or even slightly higher at the front. Don't like the ass in the air look even if it is only slight.

My '66 Elco leans to the right, about 1/2", and I have spent a great deal of time seeking the solution.

One early item I encountered was the sway bar loading, i.e. when tightened it had a pre-load twist in it. By careful measuring from a-arm to bar-end I made sure that the pre-load was taken out. The car sat 1" low on the right, after dialing in the bar it sat 1/2" low.

I tried switching front springs side-to-side, and the lean became much worse.
The springs are equal length.

I find it hard to accept that the power steering and a p/b booster is going to weigh a car down more on their side.
They're not that heavy ! Hold all that stuff in your hands, and ask yourself if that is going to be enough to compress a car spring 1/2-1" .
Try using a spring compressor to do the same thing, it takes quite a lot of force, much more than the weight of a booster and pump.

I took the batt out of the car, and it did not rise up on the right side enough to make any real difference in the problem.

Perhaps some A-body lean (to whatever side) could be a result of mfg tolerance stacking with regard to frame stamping, etc. in individual cars.
I did some very careful measuring of my frame looking for twist and damage, and found nothing.
I have seen many 107.5" wheelbase Camaros, even when thier frames are correctly jigged to the body thru the factory alignment holes. We should remember that our sixties-style cars were crooked in many places even when new. The sheetmetal inside my Elco's body is completely asymmetrical, for example. You only need to see it undressed to notice how they were slapped together in production.

None of this makes any difference when I cream a Mustang, though. I forget all about it... ahh, Rat Motors forever !

I've swapped NEW front and rear springs from side to side, and no change, no front sway bar. It's not the springs.

Lets keep this topic active and maybe we'll discover something:) Nobody has gone to the frame shop yet, so that will be some more data to crunch.

Body sag has been a problem for many A-Body cars.


My ’67 Elcamino had the same condition until I installed new body mounts and a GW negative roll suspension. I cannot tell you which one cured the problem, but I suspect it was the body mounts. :thumbsup:

Some more Ideas:
Process of elimination by taking measurements

Spring height; loaded vs. unloaded
Frame to the ground; at the body mounts
Body to the ground; at the body mounts
With & w/out shocks
Car on jacks, spindle to ground
Body alignment on the frame (side to side)
Centering of the rear axle (side to side)A tremendous amount of weight can be shifted to one side of the car by moving the body over by less than a ¼”
Cheap springs, even when new, will have different tensions form one to the other. Is it enough to make everyone’s car sag on the same side? Probably not, but it’s worth mentioning anyway.

Also, a frame out of square with a good alignment may create a *loaded* condition. This is where there is more downward pressure on one side of the
That is where you have more downward pressure on one side than the other.
It was not uncommon for a car of the ‘60’s to have a frame as much as ¼” – ½” out of square.
It is near impossible to check the frame for square-ness without a frame machine.

I'll Join the left sag club too. My 70 also sags about 3/4 inch on drivers side. New springs & bushings in front. New springs and bushings in rear and still leans. Going for body bushings this winter. My 68 does not lean & I used the front & rear springs off the 70 for it. So I rule out springs.

Well I have new body mounts, so I guess the next thing to check would be body and rear center to center. I might also have some frame sag because the alignment shop couldn't get any positive caster. Pass side tire is also wearing on the outside. I'm hoping to make it to the frame shop before Christmas.

Have to be very careful when installing the springs (mainly fronts) to get the ends sitting in the spring pocket equally side/side. I chased this also, my pass. front spring was not in the pocket correct. In the past, I had addressed this by shortening the spring on the high side a little. If the difference is significant (say over 5/8" look for a frame or install problem), if subtle (1/2" or less) , I just trim the high side spring about 1-1/2" off the coil at a time, reinstall and try it out. Short of having the car set in a jig and having a full cage built, the car is going to twist. By the very nature of the long wheelbase and the high torque motors, nothing you can do about it. Even if the frame is worked over by a frame shop, it will still get twisted again - ever so slightly.

What's weird with my car is when I rock the pass side up and down, it will level out to at least a 1/2" or better. My springs are in the pockets perfectly! Anyone else notice this?

GRN69CHV, that was my next question, how long would a repaired frame last on a car with slicks and a four speed? Assuming the frame is the culprit?

Probably 8 of 10 CHevelles that have full cages will pull the drivers side wheel more. THe long wheelbase just allows it, unlike a short wheelbase from a Camaro (67 -69 vintage) or a Nova, the long chassis twists. Only way around it is an a lot of added preload on the right rear - good for drag racing, not so great for the street.

For unexplicable reasons, a fair number of Chevelles seem to sit lower on the driver's side - both front and rear. My '65 does this as well, and my initial measurements do not leave me with any good answers. A short while back I thought I had this mostly resolved - to within a 1/4" difference at the wheel openings, which I shrugged off as production varience. I should mention that there are new Moog coil springs front and rear on the car.

After racing last weekend one of my buddies expressed shock at how much of a difference in side to side ride height my car had. I looked, and was suprised to find that the passenger side was much higher than the driver's side: 1-1/4" difference at the rear and 3/4" difference at the front.

After looking it over today I did find that I had too much preload in the right rear anti roll bar link (I had recently installed an H.R. Parts 'N Stuff chromoly anti roll bar). After correcting that I still had 1/2"+ higher frame height on the passenger side front and rear.

Without precision frame measuring equipment I roughed out various frame and suspension measurements, and nothing really stood out as the culprit. All of the coil spring pigtails appear to be properly in place, and there are no obviously cracked or damaged points along the frame. The springs appear to have fairly close installed heights - nothing approaching the difference in frame height side to side.

I will bring it into the frame shop for evaluation. What seems most odd to me, at least in my way of thinking about how a drag car could damage its frame, is that the higher side of the car is the opposite of what I would have expected - because drag launches lift the left side of the chassis up (or push the left side axle down depending on how you want to view the energy of a drag launch). It actually appears as though a 1/2" spacer under the left rear coil spring would bring everything square.

Thomas

HEY SAGGY CLUB!!! I had the same problem on my 68 Chevelle; had a BBC with the SBC a/c front springs, stock coils out back, edelbrock no hops up top in back. No a/c on car, no disc brake booster and I weigh only 200. What'd I do to cure the problem?????????????? I put coil spacers in the front and rear coils; just the 1" twist in type; and it leveled the car perfectly! I did not have a bent frame, and had a driveway alignment on the car(it tracked straight on the freewaay at 75 reallynice, and never pulled when braking). My advice; invest in the coil spacers and let go of the headache and mystery this seems to be. Just my .02 ; that actually worked.

One thing I noticed when viewing from the front of the car, the lower "A" arms are at different angles? I think anyway, it's a pretty slight difference.

I'm confident this lean we're all experiencing is not caused by:

body bushings
springs
shocks

Reference the question on the QA1'a in above posts. Puled mine out of the box again to look them over (hope to install shortly, before I pull the motor out for the 460 swap). The top coil sits in the stock upper spring pocket. The bottum bolts to the lower control arm but sits on top of it. The bottum moun is real beefy (probably 1/2" thick steel). I think a simple fab'd reinforcing plate installed between the lower shock mount and the control arm will be plenty. May not even need these at all. Will know better when I get it apart.

My 69 also leans 1" on driver side. New springs, shocks, bushings, body bushings, a complete frame off. I've measured and measured. Stared at it for countless hours. Jacked it up here, and there!! Loosened this and tightened that. I've been told that it leans because factory set them to confinsate for engine torque!! Then a guy told me it should lean slightly the the right to confinsate for driver weight!! My cars alignment is good, at 75+mph can let go of wheel it's perfect! I've decided to put 1" spacers under coil springs and get on with my life and just drive.


http://www.cardomain.com/ride/1166234

Hey guys, I lean to the right... ;) or I should say my Malibu does. RF - 27 5/8", LF 28 3/4", RR 26 1/2", LR 27"

This is after new body mounts, the 12 bolt install with new bushings, but factory springs and shocks. (No the trailing arms arn't pre-loaded)

After looking I noticed that the front control arm on the passenger side is missing the bushing. Funny, it was in there when I got the car... Guess it dry rotted and came out. The car's been in the shop for a 2 year resto and I haven't got to the front yet. I will be soon and I'll post new numbers.

Bottom line is check the control arm bushings, they may be bad. Also like Dale said, check the side to side of the body over the frame. May need to losen everything up and shift is over a bit...

David

I think the tolerances GM engineered into these cars were fair at best. A lot of compensations were made with adjustable parts, shims with a whole bunch of "eFF-it, That's good enough ! " attitude Auto makers build cars to fail after three years so as to encourage you to buy more cars. But that was back when the foreign market wasn't an issue. Personally I believe they're still stuck on that line of thinking.

I just put a 67 elky raer drivers spring in and it helped quite a bit,elky springs have 6 coils in them versus 5 on a chevelle

An air bag will help too.

Not to be odd man out...but my sag is the right rear...car has not been overhauled...but in process...new gas struts all the way around...no effect...springs are next...my hope is this will take care of it...if not, eventually new body bushings...and after that...???

thanks,
stephen

it's a mystery for sure, but it's not springs, shocks, body mounts, or bushings:(

Food for though:
What is the (left\right) shim stack up on the upper control arms?
Is there more on one side than the other?
Does it coincide with the sagging side of the car?

Think about a NASCAR with a turn or two of "wedge”?

I'll let your imagination take it from here
:thumbsup:

Driver's side lean/sag problem here too. Driver's front was 3/4" lower than the passenger front. Frame checked out on a frame rack and it was definately suspension as the LCA angle was different from side to side by measuring the difference between the inner bolt and the lower balljoint. Tried swapping springs side to side and the lean stayed.

I machined an 3/8" spacer for the spring on the driver's side (approximately 1:2 motion ratio in these cars, so 3/8" of spacer at the spring is up about 3/4" of travel at the tire)... problem solved. Car looks much better now and is level side to side within 1/8".

Troy

Troy, after installing your 3/8th's spring spacer did you have to have your front end alignment rechecked? I'm also installing a spacer in front and was wondering if I'll need to realign?

Troy, after installing your 3/8th's spring spacer did you have to have your front end alignment rechecked? I'm also installing a spacer in front and was wondering if I'll need to realign?

I checked the alignment afterwards and things were still right where I wanted them.

Troy

I have a 67 that had the same concern but mine was associated with "body-mount" rust-through. You may want to verify if the holes in the frame where your body mounts sit have not "enlarged" due to rust. I had to repair my frame by welding a piece of flat steel stock over the frame body mount hole and then redrilling it. Once I did, the body bushing sat properly on the frame (rather than sinking down into the frame) and the vehicle sits level. It is worth checking out. Is the vehicle from a rust state? Good luck

Man, I need to read more often. I been chasing my tail for about 4-months on this driver side lean. I did everything everyone else did except frame work and thought for sure that had to be the cause. My car only has 50K original miles and was owned by a older lady who was in her late 30s when bought new in 1969. It's a malibu 350 with air and no power brakes. I think the spacer idea sounds great.

might be the shocks

Troy, what material did you use for your 3/8 spacer? Could you post a pic, or a ruff sketch of your spacer? Did you place the spacer above or below the spring?
Jack

65 ss my car sits higher in the back on the drivers side. Have tried new springs and kyb gas shocks. Switched springs reoriented them no luck. Still sits higher about 3/4 of an inch. Off to the frame shop tomorrow. will post findings when I return. Hope its a tweaked frame. That would settle alot of these issues.

Just returned from the frame shop. All good with the frame. The owner of this establichment for 49 years found the problem in about two minutes. The front right spring had been cut. After a few measurements he replaced both front springs with opgi 2 inch drop springs. wow. what a difference. some rake from back to front. The 4.5 front torque thrust wheels with the willwood disc brakes look even better than before. Got lucky with the frame not being bent. Now off to the alignment shop for a quick check up.

This is a very very common problem among the 66-67 a-bodies. It has been kicked around over on the Pontiac forum quite a bit. If I remember right, some of the guys were saying part of the problem was the spring perches on the rear end housings not being welding on exactly right. Like they are angled a little or something like that. I have the same problem with my 67 and I know for a fact that the car had an easy life and was never wrecked. I just made some spacers to put on the spring perch on the low side. That fixed it perfectly and you would never know they were there. I makes a big difference in looks when your cars sits dead level. It doesn't really jump out at you when it doesn't, you mind just knows something is not right with that car.

This Is whyI'm concerned in my post today about the springs not sitting in the recessed area of the A frame or the tower The spring being 5/8 or 3/4 thick would make it sit crooked if it's not down in that pocket I think. Waiting for thoughts on that.

Boy o boy I am happy as H**l. I built a 70 SS 454 wagon. the front is pretty good, my left rear is down about 1/2" to 3/4" I have screwed with this for three years no RESULTS. So I put and old camino spring on the left and it is a larger DIA. wire than the right "Right side stock 307 spring" along witha Alum spacer under the spring and now its only a 1/2" low on the left. And it will stay that way WHY!!!!! I dont know what else to do after working with this for three years.------------I gave up its close----------------
ACES 2825

This is my second post on this subject. I just remembered something In 1966 I bought a new 396 Caprice. Every two or three months the tires were showing signs of edge ware. Baker Chevrolet in Beaver Pa. The frame rack operator would tie the front frame horns down and jack up the crossmember. The front crossmember was not stout enough to hold a 396 engine in a 1966 Caprice. It would sag depending on driving style, But i was gental........
Also that Caprice had a am/fm mutiplex. The little chevy bow tie would lite up GREEN on stereo. I could be like one guy said maby the frames are flexing.
Bob ACES 2825
SS 454--M22 org ownr Elky---70 SS 454 RED sta. wgn.

This is good stuff guys!! Guess what?? You're not alone!!! Us Pontiac guys are racking our brains too with the same exact issue...Maybe putting our heads together we can find a solution...Come and join our "Drivers side lean" party and see what we have been tossing around.

http://forums.performanceyears.com/forums/showthread.php?t=482375

anybody find a solution????????????

My Sprint sat level with stock springs. when I changed them to Moroso A-body drag springs the right rear sits higher now. I think the reason for this is certain performance springs use a higher spring rate to compensate for the need of an air bag.

I realize this is an old thread i just added it for archives. as we all know the search function is our best friend.:D
hope this helps.

Wow I'm so glad I found this thread! :D

I just bought a 1968 Chevelle Malibu sedan with 37,000 original miles. It's completely bone stock.

When we brought it home we noticed that the suspension was really soft due to it being old. So we had a friend install brand new springs and shocks with heavy duty cargo springs in the rear so the car didn't bottom out when loaded with people and luggage :)

Anyhow, one day my dad says "come here" and we walk back about 60 feet from the car, stop and turn around. Looking at the back he showed me the drivers side was lower than the passenger side!

I was beside myself, we had no idea what this could be and since we just installed new springs/shocks those could not be it. We were thinking that the suspension had been tweaked somehow but seeing as it had only 37k miles on it and was completely stock and driven by grannies, this could not be the case.

After stumbling on this thread I guess I have some things to try out!

Have we come to a consensus as to what the best thing to try first would be?

I just put my body back on the frame this morning. the driver's side is a little lower than the passenger. I'm using Hotchkis 1" drop springs. The frame is straight as an arrow, so I'm guessing the body is slightly twisted. I will have the restoration guys at the shop assess the situation, and see what they say when they get the car.

I noticed mine sits lower on the passenger side...JK

Actually it sits lower on the driver's side when someone at about 250# is in the driver's seat. Noticed that the other day when my dad was driving mine behind me and I was at the wheel of his new Shelby GT 500 drop top. Empty it sits pretty level with only a very, very slight list.

There doesn't have to be visible signs of damage for a frame to be tweaked...
Before you go spending money on springs that may not fix your problem, try measuring diagonally across the frame. Find some good reference points (like radiator support mounts or sway bar mounts in the front, and maybe body-to-frame mounts in the rear) so you can get a measurement from left front to right rear corner, and from right front to left rear corner. Ideally, these would be the same, if they're not, your frame may be the culprit, not your springs. Springs cost $$$, measuring is free.

This thread (http://www.chevelles.com/forums/showthread.php?p=644982) may help you with the measurements.


I'd also measure between the spring mounting positions/pads... Maybe place the rear axle on jack stands, and then make sure the "compressed height" of the springs are the same...


I had this problem once, and it was because one of the front springs wasn't seated properly in the frame pocket... I'd make sure thats not the problem bofore going to a shop... I think both the front and rear frame pockets have a depression for the last coil/pigtail on the spring... If the spring on one side isn't in that "pocket", then the car will sit higher on that side...

Tony brings up an excellent point about the springs being seated firmly in the spring pocket on each side. I've had them gapped a little after installed & caused this. Sometimes the springs want to rotate slightly away from the pocket stop during install.
I know it sounds pretty obvious, but it is something that can happen when installing springs.

I also have a sag in my 70, but mine is on the passenger side. I have bought new springs, but have not installed them yet!

I have noticed that when I turn left that the passenger side leans even more, sometimes rubbing my back left tire. But when I make a right turn it doesn't lean the other way. Just seems like right side is weaker. It's been that way every since I bought it.

I have read some other threads about rear height, and some of the guys said that they fixed the "lean" with (using air bags in the rear coils for ride height) adjusting the air pressure independantly, depending on the side it was leaning. I'm thinking about going that route because I want to lower the rear of my car also.

ttt Still searching for a solution/answers.

my 70 is sitting lower on the rear passenger side too. but im hoping its a spring. and when i go over a pothole that same low side squeaks. i really hope its not the frame
:confused:

I have to check the height of my 67.

Read this:

http://www.chevelles.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1860948#post1860948

Cut 1/2 to 3/4 turn off the passenger side front spring. That should cure most of the problem.

Crooked ride height is super common on these cars as you can see from the number of people who have posted about it on this thread. Cutting the springs is on solution but will alter/increase the spring rate of the cut spring. Cutting it a little bit probably won`t make a noticable difference but cutting too much will make your static problem (ride height) a dynamic one (quirky handling). A better and easier solution (and I honestly don`t mean to step on Dick`s toes here) is to use spring seat spacers that alters the installed height of the spring without changing it`s rate. The other nice things is if the car settles or something else changes you can easily swap the spacers. Once you cut a spring you can`t put the piece back on again. For 1/2" increase in height use a 3/8" urethane isolator. For 3/4" use a 3/8" helical aluminum seat spacer (the aluminum won`t compress so you get the full height increase), for 1" use a 1/2" aluminum etc. We have them in 1/8" increments from 3/8"-3/4" for about $12ea. Cheap fix,no cutting,easy to change and the spring rates remain the same on both sides of the car. Mark SC&C

Since I am from the Boomer gen., one of the rumors/theories espoused back then "in the day" was that the mfgrs. were trying to compensate for the crown in the roads which were on every 2 lane road of the day. This lean was there in the new cars as delivered from virtually all cars as I recall and the crowned road was a popular explanation. Supposedly, it made the cars look and feel more level going down the road

Now that I am thinking about it, there were very few reports of hydroplaning in those days either - the da** roads actually drained when it rained. Of course the "Pizza Cutter" width tires would cut into the water puddles better than a 50 series tire of today. Those old tires were not good for anything else though.

My neighbor weighs about 450 lbs. I usually let him sit on the passenger side when I take pics and then delete him out of the pics. Works everytime!;)