I finally got my 445 SBC on the engine dyno today. We made 6 pulls on Long Racing Engines Superflow SF901 Dyno. 200 RPM/second acceleration rate.

http://www.longracingengines.com Thanks Max, Ben, and Kenny!

The best pull was with 35 degrees timing and 82/83 jets with a power valve in my Holley 1050 HP Dominator. It was still a little rich at 12.3:1 Air/fuel ratio. Probably a little left there, but it will be fine tuned on the track.

The Results

616 lb-ft from 5200 to 5400 RPM
672 HP @ 6300 RPM (need to investigate why peak horsepower RPM is so low - I'll likely try a few new cams once I get the car to the track.)

Details on the engine can be found here:

http://hometown.aol.com/jgchevelle/engine.html

Special thanks to John Wilson, Chris W., and Dave C. for coming to watch the dyno pulls and provide input. Thanks for letting me try the Braswell Dominator John! :thumbsup:

Congrats Jason, I'm sure you'll find several more ponies somewhere in that combo. What et are you shooting for? 9's? How streetable will the combo be? How soon before you'll get some track time?

What time were your there today Jason? I was there twice today, sorry I missed ya. I would have liked to seen your dynos pulls. Nice numbers for sure

Bob,

Thanks!

I'm shooting for 9's @ 3600 lbs. The engine is surprisingly "mild". I'm sure the cubes have a lot to do with that It idled smoothly at 850 RPM with John's carb. Didn't try to get it down that low with mine. I took the video camera, but didn't get any footage of it running as the dyno room was a little cramped. As of right now, it doesn't seem any less streetable then my old pump gas 383 SBC. With my 22" case Straightline mufflers it may just surprise some unsuspecting folks with BBC's ;)

I plan on dropping the engine in the car next week to check fit the headers and then send them off to be coated if they fit. I've also got to add a few parts to my TH350, but I should have that done in a few weeks. After that all that is left is to upgrade the axles. I hope to make some passes late in spring. Got to purchase a new trailer too :mad:

Dave,

We got there about 9:15 AM and left about 1:00 PM to go grab some lunch. By the time we got back, Max and Ben had the engine off the dyno and we loaded it up in my truck. Probably left a little after 3:00 PM. We had some trouble with my starter and the dyno water pump so that delayed getting things rolling for a few hours or so. We probably started making pulls about 11:00 AM. Sorry I missed you.

Hi Jason! gald to see your having fun with the new combo! Sometime during the winter I hope to get my afr's from Mike at Lewis. I am sure the first test drive will be awesome. Let me know when you are ready or need any help with install. Tomorrow I am going to the carshow/drags at the North Texas Nissan. The show is 2 to 4 at the dealership and the gates open at 5 in denton. Good luck....cya...

Thanks Frank!

I plan on going up to watch a friend run his new (to him) car at Denton tomorrow night. I'll look you up. See you there!!

Jason

Jason, thanks again for letting me in on the action! Nice #'s for a baseline! :thumbsup: Now if I could just find me some of that TQ. :eek:

I was surprised at how tame the idle was with such a long cam. Guess those cubes tend to tame things down a bit, but 850rpm idle? Very surprising.

I'll let you know how it goes Sunday.

Got to meet a DPS officer on the way home. Said something about staying in the passing lane too long. Let me off with a warning. :thumbsup: I guess doing one continuous pass from Dallas to the Woodlands doesn't count? :rolleyes:

Cant wait to see the results Jason :thumbsup:


eating chips again John? ;)

Cant wait to see the results Jason :thumbsup:


eating chips again John? ;)

Nope! But it was 5pm on a Friday evening and I think my choice of vehicles might have something to do with it too. :(

Hey Jason,
Thought I would check out how the other side of the world communicates. I couldn't resist the username. Can't wait for this spring for all of us to get some track time, even if I still have 3.0 gears.

I can't believe the way that thing pulled on the dyno! There isn't much that beats the sound of a screaming small block. I feel confident you can make even more power with just a few tweaks to see the magic 700 hp. But once you get it to the track you may find it nice to not have to twist it so hard. I talked to Robert and he was VERY impressed. Congrats!

By the way, I did end up buying the 4" flows tonight. Hopefully the neighbors will enjoy them as much as I will.
Dave

John,

Thanks again for coming up. Sorry to hear you got pulled over. I can see where your "truck" might attract a little attention. I can only imagine the attention it gets with that pretty red '67 behind it! Good luck on Sunday.

Dave,

Welcome to the darkside!! Glad you got to come watch today. Let me know if you need any help on your project.

Congratulations Jason,,, :beers:

Small world,,, I was talking to Max at Long last week about his linebore.
One suggestion on the big inch small block.
I would talk to one of the grinders about doing that cam on a 112 sep.
Think it would pick the high RPM up some.
Do you know what the CSA ended up on your heads? The 18X is normally a little small on a big inch deal.

Thanks Mike!

I sent Jay Allen at Camshaft Innovations a spec. sheet for a new cam. I'll see what he comes up with. I'll probably end up with a few cams to try to see what really makes this big inch SBC tick. I'll run it at the track, just like it is, to get a baseline first though. Have you done much cam testing with big inch SBCs? Care to take a swag at a cam recommendation?

The heads are small for the combo for sure. The runner volume ended up at 258cc with a minimum cross section of 2.66 sq. in. at the pushrod pinch. Throat diameter is 2.83 sq. in, so I have a big "no-no" going on there. When I got the heads, I was planning on running stud mounted rockers. When I put the engine together though, the valvetrain geometery stunk so bad that I ended up ordering a set of Crower SS shaft rockers. (I'm ruined for good now. Don't know how I lived with stud girdles all this time.) Basically shot the whole point of running the 18X in the foot. I'll suffer through the 2006 season with "only" 672 HP/616 lb-ft.

Next time I go through it, I'm going to weld up the pushrod pinch and move it out (like a std. 18 deg head) to get the CSA where it needs to be and likely pick up some real good power in the process.

Very Nice! :beers: :thumbsup: :D

Thats cool Jason.. Would you scan and e-mail me a copy of the dyno sheet? I love studying those things ;)

Tony,

I'll try to get one of the pulls scanned. Each pull is 4 pages of "stuff". The air was so good yesterday that the correction actually reduced the numbers. Actual high that I saw was 686 HP.

From the first pull to the fifth pull we picked up 30 HP by leaning it out from 11:1 A/F ratio to 12.3:1 A/F ratio.

Looks like I may have a ring issue. I did a leakdown this afternoon on cylinders 1& 3. 22 and 20% leakdown respectively. I plan to check the rest of the cylinders next week. I can't believe they wouldn't be seated after two warmups and 6 pulls, but I guess it is possible. If they are all in that range I may make a trip or two to the track and see if things improve. If not it will need to come back apart. No big deal, it will give me an opportunity to add some more power.

Nice! Did Ed Bigley help you spec out that motor? lol

Here's the best pull. Still rich. The other pulls started at 4800, not sure what happened on the one.

RPM TQ HP A/F Ratio BSFC Vol Eff% Oil Press.
5200 616.3 610.2 12.21 .475 115.7 66.4
5300 616.3 621.9 12.22 .476 116.1 66.4
5400 613.9 631.2 12.10 .483 116.1 66.5
5500 616.0 645.1 12.19 .478 116.3 66.4
5600 608.9 649.3 12.10 .480 114.4 66.4
5700 604.8 656.4 12.44 .472 114.8 66.3
5800 597.0 659.3 12.33 .477 113.6 66.2
5900 593.1 666.3 12.22 .482 113.2 66.0
6000 584.6 667.8 12.11 .491 112.5 65.3
6100 576.3 669.3 12.20 .488 111.1 64.5
6200 568.0 670.5 12.39 .485 110.4 64.5
6300 559.9 671.6 12.06 .502 109.7 64.9
6400 549.8 669.9 12.29 .495 108.5 64.8
6500 538.5 666.4 12.27 .502 107.4 64.2

Bob,

LOL

I don't sing ed's praises from the mountain tops so he doesn't speak to me other than name calling and personal attacks.

Besides. I run aluminum, rectangle port heads, a Dominator, and 2" diameter headers, and most importantly ITS an SBC.........so I've got it all wrong. LOL

Looks like the HP peak may be occuring so low because of not enough spring pressure (very aggressive cam). According to Isky, it should work (running Isky cam, springs, retainers, locks, and lifters). Current springs are 235 psi on the seat / 560 psi open. I think the key factor that isn't being considered (even though I told Isky this) is that I'm running 2.15" diameter intake valves with stems that are considerably longer than stock...much heavier than the more typical 2.05 or 2.08, +.100 long valves.

On the recommendation of Jay Allen at Camshaft Innovations, the power is down and the peak power is occuring at 6300 RPM because of valve control issues. I tore into the engine today and there is evidence that Jay is correct.

New springs and a new cam is in the works, but I still plan to run the current cam to get a baseline.

Also, dropped the engine into the car. The Lemons headers aren't going to fit without some work. :( The #2 tube hits the RH upper A-arm and shaft bolt.

It isnt ever easy, is it Jason? I've got a bearing or something making noise in the rearend, gotta change converters, then pull the heads. I may stay with the cam I have for now and see what the other changes bring.

Dang, Jason. Don't know how I missed this post. Excellent numbers on your "small block", LOL. Sorry to hear about the gremlins but I'm sure you'll get things sorted out. I would think that combo would make peak power at or over 7K. That tells me peak horsepower will be higher even yet! Let us now when you get everything sorted out. Between you and Wilson I'm staying away from Texas :)

jason you say you tore into the motor what did you find that supports what jay said?

Ken,

Thanks! There is still a good bit of power left in the valvetrain and cam. From what little I know about your new mill, you don't have too much to worry about from us little 'ole SBC guys. :thumbsup:

Jason,

The valve tips show signs that the valves are rotating a significant amount for only 6 dyno pulls.

how dp you stop the rotating?

Jason,

Did you find a suitable 1.55" spring or are you gonna go ahead and cut the pockets?

Jason,

Adequate spring pressure to control the valve.

John,

The 1.56" Crower spring that Jay recommended will work set-up at the current 1.94" installed height. It has a 1.110" coil bind height. From memory the spring will come it at ~270 seat/700+ open.

Drag,

Great numbers!

I read in an old mag. article years ago about the 504" SB motor Sonny L. made and he said it is the heads that limit's a SB from making the same top end power at the same rpm's a same size BB will make if this is of any interest to you.


I guess he basically said that regardless of cc's & cube's, the heads are different, physically size-wise and to me this make's since. This is why I wished somebody would do a same sized SB/BB motor test again, but this time use the over-the-counter "mini-BB, splayed-valve" heads on the SB...

pdq67

pdq,

Thanks!

I did read that article years ago. Very interesting engine.

I wasn't expecting (or wanting) this engine to be much of a screamer. Peak power was expected to be in the 6800-7000 RPM range instead of the 6300 RPM peak as it stands. Still a few details to work out, but I believe I can still hit my power goals. In reality though, all I REALLY care about is how it gets the car down the track.

I should have enough head to get there as it stands. 258cc - 18 deg. heads that flow 350 cfm @ .700" lift. The CSA is a little small currently, but I intend to correct that and re-dyno when I freshen it next winter.

Right now I plan to "suffer" through 2006 with "only" 670+ HP :)

"670" is a little rough. Take 2 nitrous pills and call me the next day......

He, He!!

"Suffer", indeed!!

He, He!!

pdq67