finally got the car to bare metal and all prepped for some primer. so i sprayed on some green self etching (epoxy was too expensive). the paint guy recommended i follow that up with a primer surfacer. do i need the surfacer or will the etching be durable enough? the car will be sitting in a garage until probably spring or summer before i think about getting it painted. whats the best thing to do?

Probably need to spray epoxy or urethane over that etch depending on whether you will be doing and body work. If you are you will have to remove all the paint from the areas where filler is being applied since you can't put filler on the etch. I found epoxy for $155 (2 gallons RTS). I wish I had found that before I spent the time and money on the etch...

I'll let the experts detail what you need so far as surfacer.

Epoxy too expensive? You are going spend more money if you don't epoxy it or paint surfacer right on top of that etch. You need to check the MDS sheets to see what types of paint can be applied over that. Don't go buy what the painter guy tells you, follow the manufacters recommended topcoat.

You can get a gallon of epoxy for $150-200 with cat. Not cheap, but a safe bet in the long run.

Ask yourself this question, Do you want to spend $150 to do it right the first time? or spend another week sanding off all the paint (in addition to all the materials wasted) and be back in the same place?

yea id rather do it right. if i spray surfacer on top of the etch, can filler be applied? i know it cant be applied over the etching primer.

The stuff I bought was a DUPONT product (under a different name, email me if you want the exact name). I got 1 gal of primer and 1 gal of catalyst (2 gal RTS!) for $155 from a CARQUEST shop in NC if you are looking for economical...

you can also get the SPI epoxy for about $120 or so. But I think this already has a built in etch and is suppose to be applied over bare metal. You might want to check into it, lots of positive review on it. I'm still waiting to get some metal work done before i buy it.

ok good info and all, but does anyone know if i can APPLY FILLER OVER A PRIMER SURFACER. or anything besides epoxy?????

Here's the other thread I have going that addresses the filler over epoxy question (not the beginning topic but it is addressed):

http://www.chevelles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=108181

yea i understand that filler can be used over EPOXY primer. i have ETCHING primer on the car now, which can't have filler over it, but am looking to spray a SURFACER primer over top and am wondering if that can have filler applied over it.

There are primers that say you can apply body filler over but IMO and experience its not a good idea. Spend a little extra time and grind with some 80 grit after you finish hammering then apply the filler. It will be worth it in the long run. I have not found anybody who can prove to me that filler will grab on to primer better than it can grab on to 80 grit sand scratches. Also be sure to clean the metal well before applying the filler. Seems like common sense but many times people skip this important step.

No you CAN NOT apply filler over a primer surfacer. You can ONLY apply filler over epoxy...period.

Id look into epoxy primer from SPI
www.southernpolyurethanes.com (http://www.southernpolyurethanes.com)
But you would need to remove every square inch of that etch first in order to spray that epoxy.

Hold on...is there something special about that SBI epoxy? In the other thread mentioned above I was told that I can spray over the etch with epoxy, all I needed to do was rough sand the etch first...Is that info wrong?

Well I went back and read it again...looks like I was wrong, couldn't find anything saying it was safe to shoot epoxy over etch...damn what a waste of time with this etch primer!

At this point, either skip the epoxy or get one of the epoxies recommended for application over etch, I think Sherwin Williams Epoxy has to be applied over etch as well as PPG. THe beauty of SPI is it is a DTM (direct to metal) Epoxy. Otherwise, just hit the areas that need body filler with a DA to bare metal, then apply your filler. After all the body work is done, you would apply another coat of etch, then your 2K high build for final blocking and prep.

Can someone look at the PDS for what I have and tell me if they think I can spray it over etch primer (SWP990)?

http://www.performancecoatings.dupont.com/dpc/en/us/html/prodinfo/nason/491-16.pdf

It's NASON Ful-Poxy 491-16.

Scuff up that etch prime with a red scotchbrite and apply your epoxy. There should be no problems. Epoxy can be applied over any cured substrate and over some fresh etch primers after the proper flash time.

Im not sure, but I thought I was told since bondo is a porous product, applying bondo direct to the metal surface may cause moisture to develope at the substrate resulting in a corrosion point. It was explained to me to apply an epoxy primer first, then apply the the body filler followed by another coat of epoxy primer. The bondo should have enough solvent in it to act as a tie coat to the primer with good adhesion. This would make good sense when you apply the epoxy to the bondo also. Should'nt you have better adhesion of a thin film of primer to the steel instead of a thick film of bondo due to less stress. I have seen some bondo jobs end up bubbling the paint later on. Corect me if this is wrong, but I just want to make sure my project is done correctly.

I sometimes use spot putty over primer surfacer and have no problems.Filler other than spot putty must be applied to metal with a minumum of 80 grit, I use 36 on an 8 inch grinder before I use duraglas.Remember not to touch the metal before you apply filler.PPG makes a great primer but it is a little spendy,but worth it.

At this point, either skip the epoxy or get one of the epoxies recommended for application over etch, I think Sherwin Williams Epoxy has to be applied over etch as well as PPG.

NOT true for PPG.
Etch and epoxy are two different products to acheive the same thing.
It would be redundant to use both.
In the case of the original post, the filler work should have been done before the etch. Now he wants to put on epoxy just so he can put body filler on.
He really paid twice for two DTM primers by not using the proper methods.
Oh well, we all make mistakes.
Allow full cure of the etch, NOT FLASH TIME, then coat with epoxy.