Does locked out timing need a start retard? - Chevelle Tech
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post #1 of 31 (permalink) Old Jun 14th, 10, 8:45 AM Thread Starter
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Does locked out timing need a start retard?

After much thought, I'm thinking of trying to lock out the timing again at 40 degrees. The last time I did this I chipped both a flexplate and the starter. This was with a 25 degree start retard, and cranking with the ignition on. I have since heard from MSD to use only a 10 degree retard, so I don't know if that hurt it. I have also heard others, cranking and throwing the switch, which is how I had always done it before the start retard and after I took it out. I would like to try the locked out again with no start retard and crank and flip the switch. Am I just asking for broken parts again?

Ray

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post #2 of 31 (permalink) Old Jun 14th, 10, 8:57 AM
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Re: Does locked out timing need a start retard?

Do you phase your rotor? If not, then a 25 degree retard can be problematic if your rotor is already away from the terminal, especially on a small diameter cap.

The 10 degree is probably better suited, Personally i don't use a start retard. we have 2 small blocks with 14:1ish compression and locked timing at 38 degrees, the bigblock is 598ci with 14.8:1, it's had carbs an mech injection with timimg locked at 36 degree, lastly my chevelle has had compression from 9.7:1 to the 8.4:1 now and timing is locked at 35 degrees, I just crank and flip switch with all of them. They all start great that way.
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post #3 of 31 (permalink) Old Jun 14th, 10, 9:07 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Does locked out timing need a start retard?

It was a small cap distributor and no it was not phased. I know it's not very scientific, but it was more that I figured, more retard, easier to crank. The car was VERY tempermental trying to crank it. It became, stop everything else and concentrate on getting it fired. I hated it. My 540 is just under 14:1 and it seems to like 40.

Ray

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post #4 of 31 (permalink) Old Jun 14th, 10, 9:32 AM
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Re: Does locked out timing need a start retard?

I hate starting issues . I had a 555 ci with 14.1 and a 496 with 13.1 and both had a start retard on them , I never had an issue starting them . I would hit the gas twice and fire it up . It seemed to work for me . 38 locked out on both . I also had a decent flex plate and starter on both . TCI flexplate and tildon starter .
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post #5 of 31 (permalink) Old Jun 14th, 10, 9:38 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Does locked out timing need a start retard?

I have a CSR flexplate on mine, and a powermaster starter on it. I hope it works. Starter's are easy to change. Flexplates aren't.

Ray

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post #6 of 31 (permalink) Old Jun 14th, 10, 12:05 PM
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Re: Does locked out timing need a start retard?

If the above doesn't work, you might add a switch to disable/open the ign circuit then release the switch when cranking speed is up.

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post #7 of 31 (permalink) Old Jun 14th, 10, 12:18 PM
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Re: Does locked out timing need a start retard?

I'm only at 10.5-1, locked at 40*, no problems starting here. I've also heard/read that spinning a motor then turning the ignition on is harder on starter/flexplate than trying to start with advanced timing. I guess its whatever works for you.
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post #8 of 31 (permalink) Old Jun 14th, 10, 12:58 PM
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Re: Does locked out timing need a start retard?

mine is locked at 42 with no problems. heard using retard causes problems

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post #9 of 31 (permalink) Old Jun 14th, 10, 1:38 PM
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Re: Does locked out timing need a start retard?

my current bbc combo 10.5 compression tunnel ram set. with my hei locked out at 38. two pump sof the gas pedal and hit the key , fires right up the slpit second i crank it. i am using a stock gm starter.

i have had 11.7 bbc and 14 to 1 plus combos with same set up- locked out at 36-38 and using stock starters.

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post #10 of 31 (permalink) Old Jun 14th, 10, 2:05 PM
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Re: Does locked out timing need a start retard?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ddeennis View Post
my current bbc combo 10.5 compression tunnel ram set. with my hei locked out at 38. two pump sof the gas pedal and hit the key , fires right up the slpit second i crank it. .
I find this comment^ to be thought provoking and perhaps even relavent because although I haven't ever locked out the timing on any of my cars (yet) I've noticed with both the Holley 4150 and the 4500 carbs, when I pumped the accelerator ledal once before I turned the key, the engines usually fired right up, but if I don't do that, it takes the starter more turns of the engine to get it started. Might that be a factor in your combo Ray? I hope this helps.

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post #11 of 31 (permalink) Old Jun 14th, 10, 3:25 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Does locked out timing need a start retard?

I don't think it does. I crack the throttle anyway when cranking and as soon as I flip the switch it fires. But I just don't know how hard it will hit the starter. It seems great right now.

Ray

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post #12 of 31 (permalink) Old Jun 14th, 10, 5:03 PM
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Re: Does locked out timing need a start retard?

locked out at 37* here,using an msd starter saver,my research has taught me that a large dia. pro cap is what makes the difference allowing the start retard to work properly.

I only have 10.74:1 though

works flawless

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post #13 of 31 (permalink) Old Jun 14th, 10, 5:36 PM
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Re: Does locked out timing need a start retard?

I have mine locked at between 34-37 depending on a few factors. I run a 16 volt system and my 14 to 1, 565 fires right up.

One thing to keep in mind with locked out timing is it does not like low voltage. The main source of broken flex plates is from kick backs, many caused by low voltage.

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post #14 of 31 (permalink) Old Jun 14th, 10, 5:53 PM
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Re: Does locked out timing need a start retard?

Locked out at 38* . MSD digital 6 takes out 20* till engine reaches over 800 rpm's . No problems
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post #15 of 31 (permalink) Old Jun 14th, 10, 6:31 PM
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Re: Does locked out timing need a start retard?

I have mine locked at 35* with an MSD e-curve distributor that takes out 15* or 20*, depending on where I set it to start. Stays that way till about 800 rpm.
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