zz572 from gm anyone try it yet - Chevelle Tech
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post #1 of 116 (permalink) Old Aug 8th, 04, 7:00 PM Thread Starter
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Sean
 
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Anyone tried the new zz572 from gm? The pump gas versiion looks like a descent motor any thoughts... [img]graemlins/beers.gif[/img]
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post #2 of 116 (permalink) Old Aug 8th, 04, 10:21 PM
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I saw some mention of these new G.M. crate motors being sold as kits with all the parts and machine work for $11,500 by Pace Performance. I haven't seen anybody put one in a medium weight chevelle yet though so their performance is still a mystery. Hot Rod is supposed to put the higher compression one in an El Camino soon. Odd thing is they were figuring the times on it in a 3400 pound Nova instead of a 3800 pound '72 El Camino. I think they are in for a shock when they see the difference between the two cars and how much difference there is in adding 400 lbs. more weight, coil springs and 5" more wheelbase.
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post #3 of 116 (permalink) Old Aug 8th, 04, 11:48 PM
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WAY overpriced for such mediocre performance. You could put together a lot better motor for less. For instance, Shafiroff has a 540 that will give you almost 700HP for thousands less! PLUS, they offer a 2 year warranty. It just seems like a real waste of money when you can get more power for less.
But maybe it's just me?
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post #4 of 116 (permalink) Old Aug 9th, 04, 11:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by ben70:
WAY overpriced for such mediocre performance. You could put together a lot better motor for less. For instance, Shafiroff has a 540 that will give you almost 700HP for thousands less! PLUS, they offer a 2 year warranty. It just seems like a real waste of money when you can get more power for less.
But maybe it's just me?
I thought the same thing until I read the engines mag by carcraft or whoever the "race" version made over 800hp on 110 and then they retarded the timing a few degrees and used 92 still made like 790 hp for 13000 and a warranty that pretty good about the same as youll pay for one of shafiroff's ultrastreet's without the warranty.
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post #5 of 116 (permalink) Old Aug 9th, 04, 12:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by doggy69:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by ben70:
WAY overpriced for such mediocre performance. You could put together a lot better motor for less. For instance, Shafiroff has a 540 that will give you almost 700HP for thousands less! PLUS, they offer a 2 year warranty. It just seems like a real waste of money when you can get more power for less.
But maybe it's just me?
I thought the same thing until I read the engines mag by carcraft or whoever the "race" version made over 800hp on 110 and then they retarded the timing a few degrees and used 92 still made like 790 hp for 13000 and a warranty that pretty good about the same as youll pay for one of shafiroff's ultrastreet's without the warranty. </font>[/QUOTE]I just took a look at the CHP article again http://www.chevyhiperformance.com/te...72/index2.html and again I'm not that impressed. They only peaked torque at 663 ft/lbs. Not much better than a 540. Horsepower was NEVER above 700 and in fact dropped to a paltry 549 HP when they swapped cams! Moreover, you have to add in the costs and time of changing cams and doing the other tweaking they did. Besides, a tall deck block has the issue of header clearance since everything is raised. Perhaps there is another article out there that I haven't seen. Overall I still think the Shafiroff motor is the better deal since it's got a 2 year warranty and makes MORE power for LESS money.
http://www.ultrastreet.net/540_675_engine.asp

I think that anyone who gets duped into buying that zz572 has fulfilled P.T. Barnum's prophecy about suckers. It just seems like throwing money away to me.
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post #6 of 116 (permalink) Old Aug 9th, 04, 12:35 PM
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Didn't CHP swap in a cam that was smaller to try to build torque at the expense of HP? I'll bet you could get more out of one with the right upgrades. I agree, not the most HP for the money, and for that price you shouldn't need upgrades, but there's the "novelty factor" to consider as well. Some will want it just because it's new and it's the biggest thing GM sells. Some might buy it because they saw it on "Trucks" (Copperhead project), or because they don't know what there options are.
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post #7 of 116 (permalink) Old Aug 9th, 04, 12:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by kboorman:
Didn't CHP swap in a cam that was smaller to try to build torque at the expense of HP? I'll bet you could get more out of one with the right upgrades. I agree, not the most HP for the money, and for that price you shouldn't need upgrades, but there's the "novelty factor" to consider as well. Some will want it just because it's new and it's the biggest thing GM sells. Some might buy it because they saw it on "Trucks" (Copperhead project), or because they don't know what there options are.
Kirk
I think you're right. But the necessary upgrades will add more COST to the already high price tag. It will definitely appeal to the "bigger is better" crowd so they can brag or the mindless masses that don't bother to do any research. It does come from GM which can be advantageous. However, I think if you are trying to sqeeze out as much performance as possible for your dollar the zz572 is NOT the way to go. There are much better options out there.
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post #8 of 116 (permalink) Old Aug 9th, 04, 12:59 PM
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Ultrastreet engine is $11,085 when comparably equiped.Base engine is $8995 but requires over $2000 in options to be able to compare apples to apples with a 572 in terms of content.

572/620 can be had complete for about $13,000. And it makes more power. 620 is corrected to SAE, not Standard as the Ultrastreet is.

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post #9 of 116 (permalink) Old Aug 9th, 04, 1:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Gary at GMPP:
Ultrastreet engine is $11,085 when comparably equiped.Base engine is $8995 but requires over $2000 in options to be able to compare apples to apples with a 572 in terms of content.

572/620 can be had complete for about $13,000. And it makes more power. 620 is corrected to SAE, not Standard as the Ultrastreet is.

Gary
Gary, that's still a couple thousand cheaper than the zz572 plus the Ultrastreet comes with free shipping. Could you elaborate on the power issue (SAE corrected and such)? I'm not sure what that all means. Sounds interesting. I still think for 572 cubes that motor should be making a lot more power.
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post #10 of 116 (permalink) Old Aug 9th, 04, 3:19 PM
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There are two commonly accepted correction factors used when dynamometer testing. The automotive industry uses the Society of Automotive Engineers' (SAE) standard which corrects the actual measured torque output to 77 degree air and a some baro pressure (I don't recall the number of the top of my head.) And there is the Standard correction factor which corrects to 60 degree air and a more favorable baro reading.

Aftermarket manufacturers and magazines use Standard because the reported numbers are higher.

That's why the 572's make almost 80 more horsepower when a magazine tests them, compared to our advertised power output.
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post #11 of 116 (permalink) Old Aug 9th, 04, 3:53 PM
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The 572 probably isn't working as hard to make power either. If the 572 isn't working hard, neither are its parts, and when parts aren't working hard, you have an engine that can expect to have a long lifespan.
My $.02

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post #12 of 116 (permalink) Old Aug 9th, 04, 4:54 PM
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GARY,
How about the zz 502's, did gmpp use the same correction factor? They seem to have a harder time making the 502 rated output, although I love mine!!!!! [img]tongue.gif[/img]
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post #13 of 116 (permalink) Old Aug 9th, 04, 11:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Gary at GMPP:
There are two commonly accepted correction factors used when dynamometer testing. The automotive industry uses the Society of Automotive Engineers' (SAE) standard which corrects the actual measured torque output to 77 degree air and a some baro pressure (I don't recall the number of the top of my head.) And there is the Standard correction factor which corrects to 60 degree air and a more favorable baro reading.

Aftermarket manufacturers and magazines use Standard because the reported numbers are higher.

That's why the 572's make almost 80 more horsepower when a magazine tests them, compared to our advertised power output.
Gary,
That was very informative. Learn something everyday. Thanks.
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post #14 of 116 (permalink) Old Aug 10th, 04, 2:36 AM
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What I wonder is:
1. How good are the heads on that engine?
2. What happens if you replace them with something better?
3. Where does it valve float? HYD Rollers in a rat are notorious for valve float.
4. How does it run with a solid roller?

One can buy it in short block form....right?

Ron
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post #15 of 116 (permalink) Old Aug 10th, 04, 10:26 AM
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I am another not impressed by the 572. Gary, the 572 is still 2 grand more money and you get Edelbrock (GM) heads and intake while the Ultrastreet wears Darts. What justifies the 2 grand? please do not tell me R and D. They are both very basic engines, we are not talking about pro stock technology.

As for the 572 not working as hard, the 572 has a 4.375 in. stroke while the 540 has a 4.25, so technically the 540's piston speeds are lower. Neither engine has to spin very high to make the power they make. I am sure they are both very relilable. The 572 needs MUCH better heads, carb and cam to compete with the Ultrastreet. After that they need to lower the price 2 grand. I am pretty disapointed by the General on this one.

Speaking of disapointment with GM, how about the ridiculous 20 grand for the ZL-1, that is nothing more than a 454 with with fuel injection.
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